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September 2, 2012 at 1:34 pm #8442Raúl Ilargi MeijerKeymaster
We're proud to present a great little animation video by our friend Theo Kitchener from Australia. It's safe to say that Theo's vision and
[See the full post at: What the Economic Crisis Really Means (animation)]September 2, 2012 at 8:35 pm #5329AnonymousGuest
The part of the money creation story that is always forgotten is that banks do NOT create money out of thin air when they loan it into existence. That “printing” of money is based on the borrowers who are promising to use up the resources of their own future to pay back the loan with interest. This is why we not only enslave ourselves with debts, we also enslave our future selves and destroy their chances of escaping the paradigm because we lock them into the same routines.September 2, 2012 at 8:58 pm #5330Ken BarrowsParticipant
Hey hey, ho ho, globalization has got to go! Unfortunately, for their own reasons, neither most liberals nor most conservatives can let that go.September 3, 2012 at 12:40 am #5331Jerry McManusMember
Strange, isn’t it? Without the least bit of irony they draw pictures of agrarian utopia’s springing up magically out of wrecked dystopian wastelands. How in the world? Not to mention the precious bits like “can’t we all just get along” ala the late Rodney King.
Perhaps it was meant as a choice, either wasteland or utopia. If so then I think there are certainly more realistic ways of framing it. Either way I’m guessing, and this is just a guess, that we won’t be seeing much of the “3D printer” technological bliss.
Think about it. What are we actually talking about? To my mind it boils down to one very simple metric: a dramatic reduction in available goods and services. In short, impoverishment. Some of those soon to be vanished goods and services are critical, such as food, fresh water, and security. Many people will simply be unable to survive without them, permaculture or not.
Those that do survive will be tasked with adapting in place. Places that have been built out with industrial infrastructure for the last 200 years. Much of that infrastructure will be abandoned as it will no longer be useful to people without running cars or reliable electricity. Think Detroit.
Now, add to that the observed tendency of many states towards extreme income disparity and fascist police tactics to keep the impoverished majority in check. This is simply the natural tendency of humans to organize into hierarchies that enrich the imperial few at the expense of a wide periphery, ala the “Fortune 500”.
What does it all add up to? Picture this: Large numbers of desperately poor people scratching a living in vast crowded slums built on abandoned parking lots that surround a handful of high security condo towers. People who’s daily lives are ruled by corrupt police, drug gangs, and warlords.
Sound familiar? Gosh, only about 2 or 3 billion people (or more!) currently live in a world that already meets that description, or had you not noticed that?
No, not back to the stone age. We are descending ever deeper into the slum age.September 3, 2012 at 3:16 am #5332JackMember
Here in Canada there is no sign of anyone with that sense of wanting to make any kind of change to their lives.
There are those who are not effected by what is going on and they dont need to listen to this kind of talk.
Then there are those directly effected by a loss of business and employment but they are helpless.
As for the optimism in this video I think that is good but I cant see people applying it to their lives here in Canada.
Permaculture is good but can people form groups for things like this.
We have to keep on trying to have solutions or else there will be a sense of hopelessness and that is not good.September 3, 2012 at 4:05 am #5333John DayParticipant
Fine Work, Theo!
I, for one, do not fault you for tossing up some of the little hopeful tidbits, which do not form a unified prospective worldview. This future, these futures, are yet to be formed by the inspirations and actions of those of us who are paying attention, and everybody else, too. We’ve got the jump, for probably the only time in our lives, so let’s get to work. I propose building relationships and farms and, houses and machines which will be what we need in post-collapse. I also recommend pre-positioning in low population density, with temperate weather and local food and water security prospects. It’s possible. I’m engaged in the task. So are others. Your mileage may vary…September 3, 2012 at 6:44 pm #5334JackMember
The Economic Crisis Really Means war for some countries like Armenia.
If you are following Armenian news on google there is always some tension over there with Azerbaijan(they are really Turks).
It will not be long before a major war erupts over there and many innocent lives will be lost.
Both countries are heavily armed with heavy duty weapons.
Azerbaijan weapons come from Israel and Armenian weapons from Russia.
As for historical rights for those lands Armenia was an Ancient empire and it had all those lands
It gave them up because of many reasons and now Armenia is regaining strength and will try to reclaim all that back.
Knowing the fighting nature of Armenian’s and the current geopolitical situation there will definitely be something that will happening there.
@ John Day
I am happy you are an optimist also Theo.
How are people in Greece suppose to follow some of those ideas.
How can they do permaculture when they live in down town Athens.September 3, 2012 at 8:22 pm #5335Lucas DurandMember
Here in Canada there is no sign of anyone with that sense of wanting to make any kind of change to their lives.
In general I think you’re probably right, but there are a few…
Here’s a great song by Dan Mangan – a Canadian guy who I think probably “gets it”:
We have to keep on trying to have solutions or else there will be a sense of hopelessness and that is not good.
I’m not so sure there are any “solutions” in the sense that most people think of them…
It seems likely that we have entered a stage of history where the events generated by our complex existence will have more and more to do with determining the future than our own decisions will.
The best anyone can do for themselves is to “robustify” their life as much as possible – ie be ready for anything, be flexible, expect the unexpected.
As annoying as it may seem, individual experiences whether positive or negative will probably have more to do with “luck” rather than any particular strategy.September 3, 2012 at 11:55 pm #5337TheTrivium4TWParticipant
Now that this Century of Challenges link is dead…
…is Century of Challenges located elsewhere so that I can re-view it?
TIA…September 4, 2012 at 2:25 am #5338seychellesParticipant
Today pays lip service to our fellows whose dependable labor, provided at a fair profit and no matter how simple with pride of craft, has improved the lives of other people. A great tragedy of our current state of social evolution is that such people are commonly regarded as dupes. Those who have achieved unimaginable wealth and power through nothing more than a pathological ability to connive, cheat and enslave their brothers and their planet are new role models for many, especially the multitude prone to inappropriate wishful fantasy and those willing to prostitute their services for a pittance relative to the damage to life caused by their lieutenancy.
What will propel us to the other side of the approaching brick wall?
“…Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress.” Frederick Douglass (via C. Hedges)
“When people lose everything and they have nothing left to lose, they lose it.” Gerald Celente
Perhaps not too far in the future, the pushing on a string crowd will find themselves pulling on a string. Then we will have a good basis for happy talk.September 4, 2012 at 9:11 am #5339BabbleParticipant
The “printing of money” by banks misses a critical point. Yes, loaning money does create new money but that loan does work and produces real GDP. A loan for a house produces a house. A loan for a business produces a business that produces products. A loan to a farmer produces food. As you can see, new money produces new goods, it is not thrown away as most believe. Debt is a problem but I don’t believe it is anywhere close to what is being stated. I do agree that societies need to get out of the unlimited growth paradigm but they also need to stop the overpopulation or earth as well.September 4, 2012 at 6:20 pm #5346Adam GoodwinMember
Babble said: “The “printing of money” by banks misses a critical point. Yes, loaning money does create new money but that loan does work and produces real GDP. A loan for a house produces a house. A loan for a business produces a business that produces products. A loan to a farmer produces food. As you can see, new money produces new goods, it is not thrown away as most believe. Debt is a problem but I don’t believe it is anywhere close to what is being stated. I do agree that societies need to get out of the unlimited growth paradigm but they also need to stop the overpopulation or earth as well.”
This is exactly the thinking that got us here. Money ‘produces’ nothing. People produce things. Money is just a symbol of value and has no value by itself. It’s just paper (or more commonly and even worse now in this age, it’s mostly just ephemeral electrons–in quantum physics, where probabilities are the norm and reality appears to be spread out across vast distances, this medium for money probably more accurately represents the bankster’s mentality towards it). When money is loaned out, the ‘debtor’ is the only one that has possession of anything of any intrinsic value (be it a house, car, equipment etc.). The bank can offer nothing to the equation, other than it’s ‘services’ to ‘facilitate’ confidence in the current paradigm. Money has ‘objective value’ because the general population says it does through their confidence to continue participating in the game of musical chairs. That’s right….it’s a con game.
As for overpopulation of the world, that’s not an issue anyone can solve. The population argument is just a scapegoat argument to support status quo capitalist notions of ownership and systemic dependence in a consumer culture. We are not yeast in a vat. Where every person is painted as a relentless consumer right now, there will be a time (soon) when that will have to give way to a producer mentality. Population of a species is not controllable by any single member of that species. You control your own life only, so if you have a problem with what others are doing, then you change it by changing yourself. Start producing!September 13, 2012 at 9:08 am #5513BorisMember
In the civilized world, 90%+ of the people don’t already own enough land to feed themselves. Do you think these masses are going to become slave sharecroppers?
Even if the governments confiscated all the land and divided it up equally, almost the same 90% of the population would rather get a hand out or steal, rather than work the land. After all, they have college degrees, or they are just stubborn, or their entire family tree has been on welfare since the 1930’s.
There will always be 90% that aren’t going do the work necessary because it is beneath their dignity.
Yes, the community building thing is good, but I fear you’ll become the provider for your neighborhood, you’ll do all the work while they mooch (just like in society today, but it is not P.C. to ever mention it.) Don’t overlook that 90% of the population that will be looting zombies. You will never reach these people, no matter how many times you click your heels, they will refuse to break a sweat, unless it is for popping out another entitlement baby, or shopping with their EBT cards.
I’m only being realistic here. If the industrialization of the planet is cut 50%, so must too the population. Since the collapse will occur, and the population will still be over 6.9 billion, one must make equal prep in farming, self reliance and DEFENSIVE MEASURES. Charity gets old after the 2nd day of feeding your neighborhood.September 13, 2012 at 6:30 pm #5517SteveBParticipant
Boris post=5204 wrote: but I fear
Yes, you do.September 13, 2012 at 7:10 pm #5518DIYerParticipant
Clarke and Dawe again:
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