Better down that ouzo fast

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[ashvin]

And Spiegel reports that Germany has very little interest in giving the Greeks “more time” to reach their commitments. It’s true – time has never been on their side, especially not now.

“But politicians from Angela Merkel’s conservatives have resisted the suggestion that Athens should be given more time. Now a key Merkel ally has rejected relaxing the terms of Greece’s bailout deal and called on Athens to increase the pace of reforms.

In an interview with SPIEGEL ONLINE, Volker Kauder, 62, floor leader of the conservatives’ parliamentary group, rejected granting concessions to Athens, saying that the country has already wasted a lot of time due to the new elections. “In the case of Greece, time can mean a lot of money,” he said. “That’s why I can’t imagine that we could make changes in that regard.”

“It would be appropriate if the new (Greek) government were to say: Yes, we will try to make up for lost time,” Kauder said. The new government could, for example, try to speed up the pace of the privatization of state assets, he said.

Kauder implicitly criticized Westerwelle’s suggestion that the bailout terms could be relaxed. The German government shouldn’t “send any signal” that the agreed-upon austerity measures can be changed, he said.

The conservative politician also emphasized that all countries that have received EU-led bailouts should be treated the same. “The Irish and Portuguese can’t come and demand to renegotiate (the bailout deals) as well,” he said. “Agreements have to be adhered to.”

[coyoteyogi]

The foundation of any agreement are the shared values and trust of each party. I have not been to Greece. What I know has been gleaned from reading about this crisis from various sites around the internet including TAE. It appears that collectively values have deteriorated in Greece to such an extent that there is no way any agreement no matter how relaxed the terms, could be enforced or succeed. The social dynamic as become such that only a fool pays what they owe. No one trusts anyone else (outside of immediate family). This is a recipe for systemic failure and one that is not dissimilar to what happened in Argentina.
What surprises me most is how long it is taking to happen. The charade will continue until it does not. Germany will be blamed I’m sure.

[el gallinazo]

Ilargi

“[Tsipras] knows he can’t lose: if someone else wins this round, and the austerity plans are Greece’s immediate future, he’ll have another shot at gold a few months from now, because there is no way it’s going to work.”

The only way that Tsipras will have “another shot at the gold” in a few months is if there is a total rebellion among the back benchers in the ND and/or PASOK parties amounting to at least 13 members resulting in a vote of no confidence. I regard this as unlikely though we are living in interesting times.

[agelbert]

Greece is NOT going to pay the bondholders or even a significant part of any debt, PERIOD.

This guy can see what is going on in Greece;

https://thegreekperspective.blogspot.com/

[Surly1]

To the extent that “a picture is worth ten thousand words” the graphic used to illustrate this post is simply perfect.

[Brunswickian]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN_1mF-3JTI

The Genius of Mutual Indebtedness – Nigel Farage

[sangell]

If the reports out of Greece that even basic services are breaking down are true then we have moved well beyond the point of Euro membership and onto the question of EU membership.

The EU may not be much for observing democratic principles but it is a stickler for observing democratic forms. The idea maybe to force the military to seize power, huff and puff about it and expell Greece from the EU and stand back and let the Generals reorganize Greece. Then, after a decent interval and with the military having done what elected governments could not, promise to readmit the reformed Greece back into the European Community if the military steps down.

[cheltman]

Brilliant and accurate summing up of the situation by Nigel.
I NEVER thought I applaud him like this.
I’ve always been pro-Europe, and I still am to some extent but these bailouts are just funny money, smoke and mirrors and don’t solve a thing! We are being lied to treated as idiots every single day. Thanks to Nigel for exposing the madness to more people.

[snuffy]

Nice political message there. Succinctness in pointing out basic flaw in the game of musical chairs[musical banks?]now being played out in Europe.Its a pity we have no one to speak with this clarity and voice of this guy on the nightly news…as soon as one would stick their neck out …it would get chopped off.

Bee good,or
Bee careful

snuffy

[Nassim]

Hi snuffy,

Charles Hugh Smith has a couple of good articles about how Centralisation has failed (part 1) and how decentralisation will replace it (part 2)

https://www.oftwominds.com/blogjune12/centralization-failed6-12.html
https://www.oftwominds.com/blogjune12/solution-decentralization6-12.html

Personally, I think he is far too optimistic. I agree with part 1 about centralisation failing, but I think it will stop there. Those in charge prefer always to stay in control, even of a broken economy over the opposite scenario. IMHO, it may take a century to move from part 1 to part 2.

The funny thing is that he gives Egypt as an illustration of how it works – or does not. By my estimate, the army has been in power since 1952 and has almost run the country into the ground – 60 years. However, they are nowhere near relinquishing their stranglehold on power and if they were shifted another lot would take their place who are hardly more enlightened. Maybe the West really is different, but I doubt it.

[snuffy]

Hi Nassim,

I like CHS take on centralization…I wish I could get by his site more often but I am so busy in the meatworld that my time on the net is spotty/limited.
[I have agreed to ride herd on grandchildren a couple2-3 days a week]Summer s long days are way;way full

You have a good point about”What comes after” the death of centralization.Our entire civilization was designed around the centralization “Idea”…as a means to provide control of resources by whatever “elite” stabbed hacked,or clawed their way to the top of the heap,helped of course,by the local shaman.Yes,I agree there is economy of scale.But networked resources can be scary efficient
But when you read the history of England’s industrialization/centralization of power you understand why we are here now.This century its the Mexican peasant farmers run off their land by cheap corn from Monsanto…for cheap labor here in the U.S..Its the same story,with a rhyme.They are not forcing folks off their villages/farms at gunpoint this time….[starvation is much more humane 🙁 ] But the net effect is the same,cheap labor for the north,or the Maquiladora factories.Social engineering by trade policy.

This sort of story is as old as the desire of one human to sit on their ass while another busts ass to grow the food for both.

I think this big international conference on net policy being negotiated behind closed doors by many countries these days is a serious attempt to get a better handle on the net…The only way I think that CHS view of “the world after”our coming inflection point

Nice to chat again Nassim,

Bee good,or
Bee careful

snuffy

[snuffy]

clarification of last thought…

If the net survives in some fashion,CHS networked decentralization society might evolve,but the powers that be are busy trying to chain this monster as we speak..[ https://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/money/54358353-79/internet-treaty-information-international.html.csp ]

Bee good,or
Bee careful

snuffy

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