September 24, 2017 at 6:41 pm #36098Raúl Ilargi MeijerKeymaster
Robert Frank London 1952-53 ‘Tis the jolly time of elections, referendums, flags and other democracy-related issues. They are all linked in som
[See the full post at: Patriotism, Flags and Referendums]September 25, 2017 at 2:56 pm #36108Dr. DiabloParticipant
There’s so many things here. They set up the U.N. charter in order to face-slap the Soviets and harangue them day after day with “Democratic votes” in Czech, Serbia or wherever. The ability to make trouble by dividing “freedom fighters” in any nation they feel like is just an added bonus. So Catalonia can vote for independence, eh? Then so can South Carolina? The Oglala Nation? How about Jefferson, CA? Or Jim down on Maple Street who’s sick of taxes? Yeah, no. Like other psychopaths, they simply define legality by “what’s outrageous” at the time. If they like it, it’s legal and supported, if they don’t like it right then, it’s illegal and beaten with batons. And the U.N. isn’t even a glove on this, because they mean nothing and never had any cohesion or self-direction in their life — they are just the PR department for the raw power of whoever’s running it (the West) and whoever
bribespays the most.
So there is and has never been any legal structure, any logical structure, or any procedural structure. Sovereignty is about raw power, enforced with raw violence. Greece may know that, but I expect Merkel said something like, “You think a million refugees are bad? Play ball or we’ll green-light Turkey to annex you into Erdogan’s New Ottoman Empire”, a war that would last 100 years and Greece could not possibly win.
But let’s go the other way. Spain is being annexed and extracted for Germany’s pleasure the same as Italy and Greece. This has been going on since 2008. Coincidentally, in 2008 the Catalonian nationalism got a sudden shot in the arm. Here we are, 10 years of agitating and social engineering later and they’re developing a civil war. Well yes, that’s what happens when the money runs out. Yet Rajoy seems impossibly hard-handed against the province that pays the bills, and for no real good reason. Why?
Well, what happens when Spain and Catalonia get in a fight? The first casualty will be the Spanish and Catalonian bonds, which will default in some way. This could even destroy the Euro, and the EU after it. So you see, if you’re Spain and you’re in a debt you can’t pay, to an unelected, unaccountable entity that doesn’t mind 50% unemployment for a decade and would rather treat you like Greece and make you homeless on the continent you were born, then perhaps a faultless tussle amongst Iberian cousins could make the whole problem go away? You know, sort of on accident?
…Don’t worry, because Italy, with a different character, has her own plans to also destroy the EU, and we saw only some of that when they ignored the bailout rules and forced Draghi to heel, but the 5-Star and the Lira restart are right behind.
Nevertheless, some kitchen-table prophets have foreseen that someone in the Spanish-speaking world would default, it would cripple the Euro, and 48 hours later the Ice-9 seizure would be in NY. But yes, sovereignty is extra-judicial and extra-legal: they are expressions of human culture and belonging that CREATE the law, and make it exist and relevant. What sort of law do you have, in Libya, in Ukraine, where everyone just ignores the “official” government? That’s all the law ever was. Participation.September 25, 2017 at 5:13 pm #36110seychellesParticipant
You’re either sovereign or you’re not. One country, indivisible, as the US Pledge of Allegiance states (but that doesn’t mean a group of people inside a country can’t seek its own sovereignty).
History is replete with dominant minorities taking over and abusing control of “sovereign” nations. It always ends badly for all concerned, especially the usurpers. Sic transit…
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