Mar 292020

Joseph Mallord William Turner The Fifth Plague of Egypt 1800


Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m under the impression that President Trump yesterday wanted to quarantine New York City but let himself get talked out of that by, among others, NY Governor Andrew Cuomo. Cuomo went as far as calling such a measure not merely “un-American”, he said it would be “preposterous” and “anti-American”.

Obviously, Cuomo is not just of the belief, like most Americans, that a country with less than 5% of the world population is really special and superior, but also that a city with less than 4% of that country’s population is even more special than the rest. All pigs are equal, but…

There doesn’t appear to be another explanation for labeling attempts to keep New Yorkers from spreading the coronavirus around the entire country “anti-American”. Still, it would be anti-New York at best, and probably not that either. After Wuhan, China and Lombardy, Italy, New York City has become the third consecutive epicenter for the virus. Cuomo is well aware of this.

Still, he pontificates: “Then we would be Wuhan, China, and that wouldn’t make any sense..” Actually,. it would. Just look at the numbers. But: “..this would cause the stock market to crash in a way that would make it impossible for the US economy to “recover for months, if not years”.

This is possible. But that’s what Wuhan and Milan also experience(d). No stock markets there, true, but both the Italian and Chinese markets have been hit hard nonetheless. In the end it’s a trade-off. You let people die while trying to prop up markets, or you put people first. Cuomo made his choice.

Trump Backs Away From New York Quarantine

Speaking to reporters earlier on Saturday about the situation in New York, Mr Trump said: “We’d like to see [it] quarantined because it’s a hotspot… I’m thinking about that.” He said it would be aimed at slowing the spread of the virus to other parts of the US. “They’re having problems down in Florida. A lot of New Yorkers are going down. We don’t want that,” he said. New York Governor Andrew Cuomo responded by saying that quarantining the state of New York would be “preposterous” and “anti-American”.

“If you said we were geographically restricted from leaving, that would be a lockdown.” He said New York had already implemented “quarantine” measures, such as banning major gatherings and ordering people to remain at home, but that he would oppose any “lockdown” efforts. “Then we would be Wuhan, China, and that wouldn’t make any sense,” he told CNN, adding that this would cause the stock market to crash in a way that would make it impossible for the US economy to “recover for months, if not years”.

“You would paralyse the financial sector,” he said. He added later: “I don’t know how that can be legally enforceable. And from a medical point of view, I don’t know what you would be accomplishing. “But I can tell you, I don’t even like the sound of it.” Mr Cuomo also said he would sue nearby Rhode Island if the authorities there continued targeting New Yorkers and threatening to punish them for failing to quarantine.

And of course Trump made his choice, too, no two ways about it. He’s as close to literally fiddling while Rome burns as you can get in the 21st century. But when he’s trying to limit the damage with a quarantine, the folks who criticize him hardest for not doing enough, protest the loudest.

The idea that it is Trump who killed off the US health care system is tempting for media and politics alike, but it is utter nonsense. Even Fareed Zakaria agrees with me on that one just now on CNN, and that’s so rare I can’t help taking note.

At the very latest starting with Reagan, the idea has been that government is America’s enemy. And now the country needs its government, which is full of people who agree with Reagan’s ideas. So no, this is not going to go well

It’ll be something to behold what happens going forward, with 150,000 Americans infected today, moving towards 1 million by next weekend. Blame it all on Trump? Well, they’ll try. Here’s a little map of flight movements dated March 28, maybe that gives you an idea of how this disease pandemic is spread stateside:

Just about every country has stalled just about any movement of planes, but not the US. And if it’s up to Cuomo, that’s not going to happen either. Not being able to spread the disease is “anti-American”, after all. Sounds like Cuomo should agree with Trump who says: “They’re having problems down in Florida. A lot of New Yorkers are going down. We don’t want that..” Cuomo apparently does not agree.


A letter originating from the Henry Ford Health System was published (leaked?) online over the past week that perhaps provides a better definition/description of what is “anti-American” than a NYC quarantine. You be the judge. This is the best version I could find, it was published on Scribd, but later removed (wonder why). Pray tell: is publishing the letter anti-American, or is removing it? It’s still obvious enough.



The letter was sent to multiple hospitals and deals with the situation that would ensue if and when the health system become overwhelmed, something that’s hardly hypothetical anymore. It describes the practice of “triage” in the world’s richest nation: doctors removing patients who don’t improve fast enough, from equipment such as ventilators, and giving them painkillers to soothe their way into a certain and imminent death. “The other Cuomo” explains in this video:



But New Yorkers should still be allowed to fly -or drive- to Michigan, right? See, maybe that’s even better. C’mon Manhattanites, drive to Detroit. Support the US automobile industry, they’re having such a hard time.

Meanwhile, hundreds of doctors and nurses have already been infected, as have similar numbers of policemen- and women, and thousands more of each will follow. But that’s all perfectly pro-American.


PS: the funniest thing in all this is perhaps that normally Trump would agree with Governor Cuomo’s “exceptionalism” ideas, for both America and New York, but he no longer can, he has a tsunami coming straight at him. Still, doesn’t that mean that maybe Cuomo should drop those silly notions too?



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Home Forums Anti-American

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    Joseph Mallord William Turner The Fifth Plague of Egypt 1800   Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m under the impression that President Trump yesterd
    [See the full post at: Anti-American]


    Just wasn’t legal. National failure. National pain. One body by design. Interstate Commerce rules. Not EU.


    Andrew Cuomo is doing his presser saying his whole family will come together for dinner yada yada -when other countries say more than 2 people should not gather- , and nothing’s going to change New Yorkers, bla bla. The man’s a loose cannon.




    The best way – The American way

    Yards are overflowing with inventories
    Give money to employers to pay employees to stay at work making more inventory that will not sell.

    Retail businesses are empty
    Give money to employers to pay employees to stay at work.

    Every level of government, city, regional, state, federal, are spending money they don’t have.
    Send your invoice to the federal for a reembursement.

    Don’t look up from your belly button, there are dark clouds gathering over the dark and the mystic continents.


    “Don’t look up from your belly button, there are dark clouds gathering over the dark and the mystic continents.”

    I kinda like the Biblical ring. Not cuz of any Xtian bias per se but because the Bible is really good at that woe unto Babylon voice.


    Born mid-50s in CHicago to poor parents who rode the Boomer Era boom to rposperity and those juicy retirements we see fading our rearview mirrors, I was raised on miracles and wonders. SInce first encountering Jay Janson’s in ’99, I have made Hail Atlantis! my motto, meaning that somebody ought to at least be grateful for all the amazing wonders our time provides at the expense of suffering others from hominids to whales to microbes. Like the internet, the biggest Library of Alexandria we’ve ever known, soon to burn again.

    At what point does Hail Atlantis! become Fail Atlantis?

    It Ain’t Over ’til One of the Butt Sisters Sings…


    This is a murky area. I’m from NY (upstate – constantly need to remind New York City there is a state attached to them). When I first heard this yesterday it made sense. We’re a mess here. Shouldn’t be traveling wherever and exposing everyone else. Then I started thinking about logistics. A huge number of airline flights come through NY state through a variety of hubs. How would that work? No one changes planes on their way through? That’s just one of the logistical issues that popped into my head. Wall Street is another, but that topic is too complex for this venue. Then I also considered what happened in Italy. Locking down only northern Italy backfired in the worst possible way. Regionswork, above, is also correct. We aren’t Europe. We’re one country. United under [apparently] God. Indivisible … blah blah blah.

    I’ll end with … Trump is doing an absolutely awful job with this. I didn’t vote for Trump (or Hilary), and I’ve completely avoided jumping on the “Trump sucks” bandwagon over the past few years. With this pandemic? Is F- a grade? Does that exist?

    John Day

    “Hail Atlantis!”
    My wife and I aught him in a small club in the late 1990s.
    Cool guy. I think he did this one. an’t remember for sure.


    About the Henry Ford Health System letter: I’ve been following Italy and they’ve had to implement similar measures. In Italy only those with very high fevers and significant breathing issues are even admitted to the hospital (everyone else stays home to, hopefully, recover). An Italian emergency center doctor said if you have several co-morbidity issues they don’t move you to the ICU for care when you worsen (you aren’t going to make it anyhow). That’s reality. We can’t save everyone so resources are targeted to the people who have the best chance of surviving. (I’m older and have immune system issues so I’m not being callous with this – I likely wouldn’t get ICU care when/if the chips are down).

    John Day

    My “c” is malfunctioning…
    Larry Romanoff has good analysis again.  I make no claim to being a virologist, but this is beginning to look damned peculiar. A natural virus hasn’t the ability to simultaneously infect 85 different countries on all continents of the world, with outbreaks in multiple locations in each country – and to do it without the vehicle of a seafood market full of bats and bananas.
     More peculiar is that these countries were by no means all infected with the same variety of the virus, which means the simultaneous infections in these 85 countries were not from the same source. Even more peculiar is that most countries, at least the major ones, reported simultaneous outbreaks in multiple locations, and to date while some nations have been able to identify one or more of their ‘patients zero’, I am aware of no country that was able to definitively identify all their several ‘patients zero’. Considering the above information in light of the known basic facts of virus transmission, intuition suggests at least the possibility of there having been many people carrying a pail of live viruses.
     It is interesting to note that high fatality rates are entirely within Italy, Iran, and China. For approximate figures, China’s fatality rate is between 3% and 4%, that of Iran at about 7% and Italy the highest at around 9%. Even more interesting is that if these countries did pass their strain of the virus to other nations, those strains abandoned their lethality when they left home. Of the 34 countries supposedly infected by Italy, for example, all exhibit very low mortality, the same being true of Chinese or Iranian infections. The natural conclusion is that these viruses prefer their ‘home populations’ and pose at best a minor threat to others.
    Oh, this is funny, but it is a lead to follow. I was telling Jenny just now that I can’t figure out who would benefit from releasing waves of mild-by-military-standards weaponized virus upon the world.”This is evil genius stuff”, I said…Then I remember that a friend form Switzerland, high end audio uber-geek, had sent a TED talk by Bill Gates from 2015, explaining how the Ebola epidemic shows we are not prepared for the next viral pandemic. The picture Bill flashes after he walks in with the drum of survival rations for his childhood bomb shelter is CORONAVIRUS. He does not say that.Bill goes on about the wonders of NATO and having doctors in teams ready to go to poor African countries so women can give birth safely and children can get vaccines. Nice guy in Mr Rodgers sweater giving talk that predicts our current scenario rather neatly.
    Bill resigned as CEO of Microsoft in January.I wondered why… Hey, I just looked up Microsoft headquarters. It’s in Redmond Washington, which is to Kirkland, as Ft Worth is to Dallas, a confluent urban center. Kirkland is where all hell broke loose with coronavirus, right after Bill quite as CEO. A lot of CEOs resigned in January, I hear. I wonder where Bill is now.He got Event 201 up and running in October, just as it appears novel coronavirus was entering human hosts. I’m going to say that following-Bill-Gates’-money is our best lead on this global pandemic Malthusian biowarfare.We know Bill believes secret sterilization vaccines are the save for human overpopulation.Bill Gates may actually be trying to HELP the world by spreading a pandemic virus that only kills 1-5%, and mostly the weaker ones. It may have other knobs he can turn to increase and decrease mortality. From this 2015 TED talk, Bill seems like he was already working with NATO. He talked them up pretty well.With Bill running the main project, other military/spook participants would be able to pitch some curve balls, more deadly viral strains, after Bill’s humanitarian effort was already underway, and understood by global elites as a helpful thing.
    Here is Bill on Saturday saying the entire US has to shut-down right away for 6-10 weeks. “Anything less will not work”.”State by state and county by county will not work”, says Bill. (How can you be so sure, Bill? It worked in China.)  

    Dr. D

    They’re right, by what I can tell, “locking down” people without specific adjudication is illegal, and it should be. The next Rumsfeld will then call a light breeze a “National emergency” and invoke those same powers against a) you b) the other party c) people who bug him most, and eventually d) everybody. That is, if this guy doesn’t do it first, while everybody cheers, primarily leftists. Good to know when Orange Hitler is around, the “Resistance” will surrender instantly and beg to obey. “Mr. Trump, shut this country down!!!”

    However, they claim sweeping quarantine rights and every other emergency right , including complete confiscation of all your property, and conscription to anything they feel like, including breaking rocks in a uranium mine as a unpaid slave. Or even unpaid prostitute, probably, it’s legal in some states. No joke. On the books.

    In reality, we use a safety valve where the government claims these powers and enforces them, the people mostly comply, and the cases wend their way through the courts where in a year or ten it will be declared illegal and unconstitutional again. Until they do it again without asking.

    That’s pretty important though. So let me get this straight: we lost 500,000 men to defend freedom when the nation was less than half this size, or what would be 1 million men today, but you won’t defend freedom with even one death today? Congratulations, you’re a slave. No matter what the government says, you will do it. And this while China may be going the other way, toward freedom, by waving OUR flag, and laying their bodies down on a bridge in Wuhan.

    You don’t have to be reckless, but you don’t have to beg for eternal tyranny to save one port town that was about to fall into the sea, either. There are places in between. Perhaps not being American, it’s hard to understand. I expect from birth that there will be cost associated, that’s what turns “freedom” (i.e anarchy) into “liberty” (i.e forbearance and responsibility). Government isn’t going to do that; governments most probably paid to have this thing created, released it accidentally on purpose, covered it up until a few million cell phones went missing, then dragged their feet for 2-odd months, told people to attend the NYC parade while St. Andrew (Cuomo) approved, then argued largely about the name not the response, and are right now attempting to outlaw a cure in France, Nevada, and Michigan. But we need this government somehow, the one who caused it and is struggling valiantly NOT to cure it. They are our lovers, our helpers, our masters? If not this, what will it take for that to seem illogical? The murderer that caused it is NOT the guy to turn to for help.

    Well, it’s going to go this way, but as an epidemic people will die, because that’s what an epidemic is. So should we have 100,000 die by providing what guidance and cure they can, then return to normal, or should we have 50,000 die and live in a Stalinist dystopia for the next 100 years, having abandoned all our principles for a little safety? Because if you do, they will be eager to have it, and you’ll instead kill 100 Million over those upcoming years of constant fear, injustice, and privation, for today’s senseless fear and lack of valor. For all men die, be it sooner or later, but not all men die FOR something. If you abandon all freedoms and the republic, you will have died for nothing. And so will have your father, in WWII, and his father, in WWI, and your ancestors in Runnymede. Make their lives and Western values mean something, and don’t surrender to Chinese (lack of) values so eagerly. It was a lot of their values that got us into this. Reject them and choose freedom and life instead.

    It’s beyond my imagination how people can behave this way, they’re not shelling my town, they haven’t even cut off Netflix for God’s sake. Be a man.

    You. Will. Die. Say it over and over again until you realize it. You almost certainly won’t die of the virus, but dodging it won’t save you one little bit either. So you might as well live brave and do right, as your fathers before. If they hadn’t, you wouldn’t have the luxury of fearing comfortably now.


    Since the USA is so huge, I’d like to see the cases etc broken down by state and region. For CA we have 2 or more main epicenters. I’d also like to see added columns for containment strategies, ie lock down, suggested and mandetory. And also a column for the strain of virus most common. Can some of those university students work on this? There are some very needed info it would be great to have. I know this will be too little and too late, but who can track that data?

    I’ve been hearing some stories in the Bay Area about people having their groceries stolen at knife point. And 2 SF taxi drivers loudly arguing over a $5 cab fare. Also stories of child abuse by freaked out, drugged or drunk parents. Nobody wants to talk about the social distress beginning to surface. But it is there.

    Again thanks, Raul. – Everyone please donate to this important blog.

    John Day
    Thanks for sending this, Tyler. The website format is edgy, but this is serious content:.
    ​ ​”I am an ER MD in New Orleans. Class of 98. Every one of my colleagues have now seen several hundred Covid 19 patients and this is what I think I know.​”​
    ​ ​Clinical course is predictable.
    ​ ​2-11 days after exposure (day 5 on average) flu like symptoms start. Common are fever, headache, dry cough, myalgias(back pain), nausea without vomiting, abdominal discomfort with some diarrhea, loss of smell, anorexia, fatigue.
    Day 5 of symptoms- increased SOB, and bilateral viral pneumonia from direct viral damage to lung parenchyma.
    Day 10- Cytokine storm leading to acute ARDS and multiorgan failure. You can literally watch it happen in a matter of hours.
    81% mild symptoms, 14% severe symptoms requiring hospitalization, 5% critical.
    ​ ​Patient presentation is varied. Patients are coming in hypoxic (even 75%) without dyspnea. I have seen Covid patients present with encephalopathy, renal failure from dehydration, DKA. I have seen the bilateral interstitial pneumonia on the xray of the asymptomatic shoulder dislocation or on the CT’s of the (respiratory) asymptomatic polytrauma patient. Essentially if they are in my ER, they have it. Seen three positive flu swabs in 2 weeks and all three had Covid 19 as well. Somehow this b***h has told all other disease processes to get out of town.​..
    ​ Basically, if you have a bilateral pneumonia with normal to low WBC, lymphopenia, normal procalcitonin, elevated CRP and ferritin- you have covid-19 and do not need a nasal swab to tell you that.
    ​ ​A ratio of absolute neutrophil count to absolute lymphocyte count greater than 3.5 may be the highest predictor of poor outcome. the UK is automatically intubating these patients for expected outcomes regardless of their clinical presentation.
    ​ ​An elevated Interleukin-6 (IL6) is an indicator of their cytokine storm. If this is elevated watch these patients closely with both eyes.​..
    ​ Disposition
    ​ ​I had never discharged multifocal pneumonia before. Now I personally do it 12-15 times a shift. 2 weeks ago we were admitting anyone who needed supplemental oxygen. Now we are discharging with oxygen if the patient is comfortable and oxygenating above 92% on nasal cannula. We have contracted with a company that sends a paramedic to their home twice daily to check on them and record a pulse ox. We know many of these patients will bounce back but if it saves a bed for a day we have accomplished something. Obviously we are fearful some won’t make it back.​..
    ​ Treatment​: ​Supportive
    ​W​orldwide 86% of covid 19 patients that go on a vent die. Seattle reporting 70%. Our hospital has had 5 deaths and one patient who was extubated. Extubation happens on day 10 per the Chinese and day 11 per Seattle.
    ​ ​Plaquenil which has weak ACE2 blockade doesn’t appear to be a savior of any kind in our patient population. Theoretically, it may have some prophylactic properties but so far it is difficult to see the benefit to our hospitalized patients, but we are using it and the studies will tell.​..
    ​ We are also using Azithromycin, but are intermittently running out of IV.​..
    ​ ​Proning vented patients significantly helps oxygenation. Even self proning the ones on nasal cannula helps​.
    [That means people breathe better face down. Got a massage table?] ​…
    ​ One of my colleagues who is a 31 yo old female who graduated residency last may with no health problems and normal BMI is out with the symptoms and an SaO2 of 92%. She will be the first of many.
    ​ ​I PPE best I have. I do wear a MaxAir PAPR the entire shift. I do not take it off to eat or drink during the shift. I undress in the garage and go straight to the shower. My wife and kids fled to her parents outside Hattiesburg. The stress and exposure at work coupled with the isolation at home is trying. But everyone is going through something right now. Everyone is scared; patients and employees. But we are the leaders of that emergency room. Be nice to your nurses and staff. Show by example how to tackle this crisis head on. Good luck to us all.”

    Dr D Rich

    CDC statistics for 2017-18 U.S flu season

    **** 45 million illnesses

    **** 810,000 hospitalizations

    **** 61,000 deaths 

    Ask Dr. D what death from pneumonia by any cause looks like. It looks really bad. It is also a catastrophe for that person and their family

    Dr D Rich

    We all share in the pain differently.
    I didnt know the director for the JFK Center made hospital CEO level coin. Let the symphony eat cake.

    “Rutter, meanwhile, told the Washington Postthat she would forego her $1.2 million salary while the JFK center was closed.”

    Dr. D

    Glad I’m not the only one wasting air on the Top 50 Amazing Coincidences of My Sherona.

    Hey, did you know far from gutting the CDC, Cheeto hired a bunch of quarantine experts back in November? Yeah, just a few months before signing the “Right to Try” bill that allows people to take experimental Chloroquine, but BEFORE Gates’ pandemic war game that had a deadly coronvirus in Italy. You could write a book, and we haven’t even dug into the white papers yet.

    P.S. you schmarty-pantz shut-it-down thinkers now have food riots in Italy. Dodge this. There is no health care without an underlying economy, and no need for health care if you get stabbed because no one has food. Live brave, not weak. You are a child of men who survived a thousand times this, a thousand times in history.


    Aloha All:

    Hmm… New Yorker’s escaping the city, eh?

    Reminds me of the group from Seattle checking into one of our posh hotels here on the west coast of Hawaii island to play golf. And TO GET AWAY FROM THE QUARANTINE in Washington State.

    Gee Thanks,
    L.T.King MD


    Well, Dr D, I think you pinpointed it with this statement: “It’s beyond my imagination how people can behave this way, they’re not shelling my town, they haven’t even cut off Netflix for God’s sake.”

    No, we aren’t being physically threatened by shelling and gunfire. We’ve been asked to isolate ourselves to slow the virus and help others who are/will bear the brunt of this: healthcare workers, seniors, and both young and old people with underlying health issues. And we’re trying to step up and do the right thing. My sister is a doctor. If doing what I can to make her life easier is cowardice, I’m in.


    I’m sorry, Lonnie_King, and don’t blame you for your ire. Please understand the vast majority of New Yorkers aren’t hightailing it out of the state to infect others. The people doing this type of thing are the usual suspects: those with lots of money (the rest of us couldn’t afford to flee even before we lost our jobs). I’m sure it’s the same with Washington fleeing to HI. I can’t imagine being on the receiving end of such self-centered actions. (Oh wait … there is that recent stimulus package that sorta tossed us peons only a few crumbs).


    White House Extends Coronavirus Guidelines Until April 30, Trump Expects “Peak” In About 2 Weeks
    U.S. President Donald Trump will extend national physical distancing guidelines to limit the spread of COVID-19 until April 30.

    To be effective, extending “stay at home lock down” will have to be modified.

    “stay at home lock down”
    1. for anyone with symptoms of the coronavirus
    2. for anyone retired who don’t want to gamble getting the coronavirus

    B.C. doctors urge province to close all non-essential businesses, enforce social distancing
    The province defines essential services as “essential to preserving life, health, public safety and basic societal functioning. They are the services British Columbians rely on in their daily lives.”

    As for non-essential services, the province says that “any business or service that has not been ordered to close, and is also not identified on the essential service list, may stay open if it can adapt its services and workplace to the orders and recommendations of the provincial health officer.”

    Enforcement to flatten the curve
    B.C. Health Minister Adrian Dix agreed that enforcement will be necessary.

    “We understand that this is the period to flatten the curve and it’s everybody’s responsibility to do that,” Dix said, referring to keeping the number of infections from rising quickly.

    Dix reinforced Henry’s message that B.C.’s measures are in line with those in places like California where 16 sectors are exempt and people are still allowed to go outside.

    Henry said the province is looking at additional measures to reach people of all ages so they’re aware of the social distancing rules.
    The latest:

    Trudeau announces funding for Canadians young and old who are struggling to cope.
    Dr. Anthony Fauci says between 100,000 and 200,000 deaths in U.S. possible.
    Trump extends U.S. physical distancing guidelines until April 30.
    Virus-hit cruise ship with Canadians on board cleared to transit Panama Canal.
    Foreign Affairs confirms Canadian died in Brazil ‘after falling ill on a cruise.’
    More than a million Canadians have applied for employment insurance.
    Sophie Grégoire Trudeau says she has recovered from COVID-19.
    A COVID-19 glossary: What the terms mean and some subtle differences.
    INTERACTIVE / Tracking the spread of coronavirus.

    More than a million Canadians have applied for employment insurance due to the coronavirus outbreak, according to Jean-Yves Duclos, chair of the federal cabinet committee on COVID-19.


    Masking the Face

    I made myself a face mask that is amazingly tight, comfortable, low pressure (due to the probiscoid air tranfer unit (PATU) and able to be filled with more filtering material due to the PATU’a large filter expansion chamber.

    Tomorrow: on smiling with one’s eyes.


    Ahem… trying again:

    Face Mask



    The fact that few governments are incapable of doing a proper lockdown that keeps critical supplies going is not proof that lockdowns aren’t proper methods for ensuring a populace protects against a pandemic properly. It’s evidence that our governments are at the end of their rope, with or without a gallows noose at the end. (What first seemed like a neat handle for holding on to your lifeline becomes a hanging.)

    Of course there will be major civil unrest and at least a little blood.

    I watched Chicago burn for five days in 1968 while my fireman Dad fought fires, looters, and dodged bullets. Just because the government shot some guy telling the truth too well and too effectively. Who here wasn’t expecting at least a significant chance there’d be civil unrest over the upcoming election fiasco-in-the-making? Who here didn’t think that this virus thingie was Most LIkely to Be a Black Swan?

    No One Likes To Be Locked Down except people with unusual ‘issues’

    The trouble is that we didn’t do it right away, when it is highly effective and minimally disruptive.

    Does anyone think the populace would behave kindly if everyone was running about normally and people started getting really really sick because their neighbor coughed on them? Meanwhile, NYC, everyone’s favorite place to get mugged, is experiencing a major reduction in able police officers. Because we didn’t lock down soon enough.

    Timing is very important in things. Last I heard it shares equal billing with mass, energy, and space.

    John Day

    Q: What did the elephant say to the naked man?

    A: “How do you breathe through that thing?”


    PLaying devil’s advocate here for sake of logical stringency:

    “I make no claim to being a virologist, but this is beginning to look damned peculiar. A natural virus hasn’t the ability to simultaneously infect 85 different countries on all continents of the world, with outbreaks in multiple locations in each country – and to do it without the vehicle of a seafood market full of bats and bananas.”

    I make no such claim either, but it seems to me that a world with people traveling cross-continentally and intercontinentally in trips lasting at most half a day,in whic h people are places in huge metal winged tubes with notoriously dry air, entering and exiting in mass congregation terminals with many bottleneck/checkpoints, could do such a thing quite easily.

    “More peculiar is that these countries were by no means all infected with the same variety of the virus, which means the simultaneous infections in these 85 countries were not from the same source. ”

    Is it also possible that the warning from Wuhan, which increased for vireal contagion, may have unveiled a number of new viruses already happening but not yet entered into the Book of Known Viruses.

    We vaccinate for the flu. The Flu, we call it, although I understand (foggily, from reading done through an anemic haze) that the actual vaccines address a spectrum of ranges of predicted mutations (or something like that), is deemed Business as Usual. Someone goes to the doc with icky symptons, they generally test to see if it’s antibiotic or viral and, if needed, run a spectrum test for things like MERS, etc., right? If none of those, they send the patient home unless they’re critical, tell them to drink gobs of water, take Advil, eat healthy fresh food as much as possible, and rest, rest, rest. There could be lots more varities floating around than our med establishment tends to think. Could be that the buzz from Wuhan made people look at their usual cases of “the flu” differently. Especially when people started ‘red-eyeing’ and experiencing cytokine stoprm organ failure. Correct me if I’m wrong. I like it.

    J.D.: Man says to elephant: so you stick that thing up your wife?

    For the record, it works like a dream. Easy snug tight fit, the sock-foot expands and contracts like a ventilator balloon (do they still have those?), and it doesn’t get too hot cuz of the wide respirator filter surface area. It also makes people laugh, which reduces the Stanger Danger masked-man phenomenon.


    “Is it also possible that the warning from Wuhan, which increased for vireal contagion, may have unveiled a number of new viruses already happening but not yet entered into the Book of Known Viruses.”

    ‘which increased testing’

    Oh. Yeah. Gates resigning in January could just mean he saw what was coming and decided he had better things to do than pretend to run Microsoft while hanging around an apparent virus epicenter. Not that I’m a Bill Gates nor a basher. I wwould think he has a fairly unregulated narcissistc affect from being the richest man in the world for some time, in the coolest industry since rocket sceince. I also recal reading stuff suggesting he was a CIA asset, wittingly or not, since the Dawn of DOS.

    Secret tetanus sterilizations? Beats abortions. There are no easy choices, and our sacred right to breed as we wish is a cultural delusion.


    Oh, it occurs to me the mask is not immediately recopgnizable as a sock. Cut along dorsal line to top of heel, along ventral line about the same length, and voila!


    I am surprised and dismayed to see all of the libertarian sites crowing about loss of freedom and the rise to tyranny. A pandemic is precisely the time when collective action is required, and when there is a need for a strong and competent government to close borders and regulate the movement of people. I agree that authoritarian forces do not let any crisis go to waste, but the time will come to push back against those forces after the crisis is over. There is a big difference between the threats of “terrorism” and disease. The former was always overblown, capitalized on irrational fears, and led to ridiculously intrusive searches at the airport over a threat that was largely in the collective imagination. The Patriot Act was a national disaster. Snowden, Manning and Assange are heroes of our day.

    Disease is an entirely different beast.


    The article about Bill Gates/Event 201 isn’t passing the initial sniff test. Sometimes, deeper investigation finds that it is relioable info, but sao far, pulling up the floorboards has revealed no hidden dirt, just a bored floor. Anyone find anything hiding under the basement, probably in some secret underground lab, please let us know. Otherwise, I’ll dismiss that one as more of something whose name I detest: “fake news”.


    Also, both SARS and MERS are both cornoaviruses, so it would be natural for any global pandemic forum to focus considerable attention on coronaviruses.


    Way back when …. I made a link to that pandemic forum for everyone to evaluate.
    Included was a link to who was there.
    The people who were there were the elites of Emergency Management. They were influential. People listened and were influenced by their opinion.
    Obviously, not ignored, like me.

    Sooooo the USA did know what was coming and tried to sweep it under the table.

    Here is someone who thinks so.

    Posts: 814
    Jesus ****ng Christ.


    Somehow he and the other ego maniacs in his administration, thought they could write off a goddamn Pandemic as a bad flu season.

    Im serious lets look at the facts…This only got exposed when a clinic or research group in Seattle risked their license or whatever and told the CDC to fuck off and published the results of their tests, those tests were run against the cluster in the old folks home and it couldnt be hidden anymore.

    He basically admitted it today, that they considered riding it out, and it completely fits the facts.

    They didnt care that the tests didnt work, they didnt roll out massive testing, they rejected the WHO tests, and they didnt prepare at all, because they made the calculation that it wasnt going to be that bad, they could write it off as a bad flu season and that would be that.

    Why did they think they could do it? Because if it hit over the summer the likelihood would be that it would be a lot less virulent, but it would infect enough people to give some measure of herd immunity to suppress R0.

    It makes sense, in fact Im not saying that it is the worst idea in the world compared to total economic collapse, I have argued that it may be better to just take the fucking hit and so have some other countries, such as Sweden, and to a degree Japan and South Korea.

    Basically they are only testing if cases get bad enough to require hospitalization, and then doing contact tracing because it blows their fucking game.

    The long game is to just let it silently propagate until you get enough people that have had minor cases that it can no longer find enough hosts to spread and R0 becomes depressed.

    Its not a bad plan when you look at the total global economic impact of the body county of a World War + Shutdown vs just eating the body count of a World War and carrying on as normal.

    No what is so fucked up about it is that they thought they could keep it secret, its fucking transparently obvious what has happened.

    Its one thing if you and Boris and Merkle and everyone else have to stand up there and have some balls and say look theres nothing we can do on this one, it has to burn through, isolate your old folks and Immuno compromised, let the young kids who have a very low probability of complications get it, let the otherwise healthy people get it and it will be over sooner

    Like I said I could respect him if he did that, if he and the other world leaders had to join hands and say we know this sucks and we will do everything we can to make it suck less, but we cant shut down so that life can carry on…

    We could have done that, by taking the TWO? THREE? FUCKING MONTHS? To stockpile medical equipment and drugs, rush through a bunch of new Nurses and doctors, to unretire any former military medical staff who are on an active ready reserve, setup field hospitals, etc.

    You know all the shit we are having to do now?

    Yeah if we had just done all that shit and been transparent about it, it would have sucked, but it wouldnt have been the end of fucking western civilization as we know it.

    But…they… thought…they could…hide…it?


    We’re going to learn to live with it.
    What’s at stake is HOW.

    Your best rhetoric ever, Dr. D. Nicely put, zerosum.

    Dr D Rich

    Sure. just bailed out a supposedly solvent Capital One. Not one single American’s credit card, underwater mortgage, auto loan or student loan debt was forgiven, but Capital One gets bailed out by a .GOV
    Now tell me how coronavirus exolains this financial chicanery in the context of Overnight REPO, QE 3 or 4 (I lost count), and last week’s FED rescue totaling $4.5 trillion dollars?
    Just who are these leaders saving and, as Dr. D said, why are you making excuses for them while we all are subjected to austerity and social isolation?

    “Beyond mass hysteria this chaos has the features of Dissociative Disorder throughout the general population.
    Dissociative disorders involve problems with memory, identity, emotion, perception, behavior and sense of self. Dissociative disorders usually develop as a way of dealing with trauma. Dissociative disorders most often form in children exposed to long-term physical, sexual or emotional abuse. Natural disasters and combat can also cause dissociative disorders.”

    Dr D Rich

    On a serious note and all kidding aside, I wouldn’t be surprised if Trump, Xi and Putin surrendered to our Alien Overlords on Wednesday, April Fool’s Day


    Jesus. Come on, mm! He is as close to Nero? Fiddling while Rome burned? Dude. Take a pill. Calm yourself down. Your doomsday columns are columns you will grow to regret.

    Seriously. Take more long walks. Relax. Calm. Yourself. Down.

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