February 17, 2022 at 12:55 am #101677
“John Locke”… was an interesting fellow but he also wrote the charter for the slave colony called South Carolina, my natal state, in 1669.February 17, 2022 at 1:04 am #101678
“The trial will test 56 healthy, HIV-negative adults, and is being funded by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation.”February 17, 2022 at 1:13 am #101679
Okay. My last post about masks because everyone’s mind is probably already made up:
You may recall that in the early days of the pandemic, the superspreader events were events with a lot of vocalization. Churches and choir practice, for example. In Korea it was often call centers with many people sitting in close quarters and talking all day long. It was never buses and subways where people sit in close quarters but usually do NOT talk . Here is the visual evidence of what happens when you speak without a mask, but for some people, I know, seeing is NOT believing:
Yes, we learned later that the virus also passes by aerosolized transmission, but that is in addition to droplet transmission, not instead of droplet transmission. Besides, areosolized transmission requires a longer exposure in a confined space with poor ventilation.
Japan never used Ivermectin on a wide scale, though the head of the Tokyo Medical Association made favorable comments about it in August 2021. And to the extent it was used, it was used primarily for treatment, not prophylaxis. Korea has its own co-morbidities. Obesity is not as big a problem, but Vitamin-D deficiency is more severe. That is why as recently as December, Korea had to go back to strict social distancing because the hospitals were full with only 7000 new infections per day — a drop in the bucket compared to the US. Finally, I don’t think there were a lot of unreported cases here. Track and trace remained in effect, so many people were sent for testing even if they had no symptoms. Several times my employer sent me for testing because someone in the office was a positive case.
Understood with the comment about the kids, but that speaks to a different issue. Speaking from personal experience, the kids here would rather be in school wearing masks than sitting at home without a mask and connecting by Zoom. The kids have plenty of time to play at home after school with other kids in a maskless environment. If the message from the parents is that it is normal and common sense to wear a mask in schools, the kids adjust just fine. If the message from the parents is that this is scarring you for life, then I fear it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.
Again, there was some use of Ivermectin in Japan, but this was never widespread, and it was never used as a prophylaxis strategy.
Bottom line: This is the real life clinical trial. There are 25 million people in greater Seoul, and almost all have complied with widespread masking. We never had a lockdown. People always went along with their normal routines, except that the size of gatherings in restaurants was limited. I am convinced that widespread masking is a big factor, and I have not heard a better explanation. I look at the other major cities in Asia, and compare those to the major cities in the West, and there is an obvious difference in behaviors and outcomes. I think that is undeniable, but I also recognize that nobody in the West wants to see what I see.February 17, 2022 at 1:15 am #101680
Thanks again for the Corona Investigation Committee info. I have a check about it though, there is a very subtle counterintelligence vibe about it. Credible but yet incredible enough to marginalize a large number of people. I get it names, dates
documents and so forth.
I never really need to (should never) go there when discussing this with a true believer vaccinator type.
I just have to ask a few questions.
Do you know what is in the vaccines? Typically they do not.
I say there are three things that trouble me, aluminum, LNPs and foreign protein antigens that are produced in the trillions upon injection.
I demonstrate how the lymph flows from the muscle back into the bloodstream into heart then out to the critical organs.
I then say, aluminum, LNPs, and spike proteins cross the blood brain barrier. Please look it up and the we can have a proper discussion.
Though that other stuff is (seems) credible, I have greatly diminished my risk of being labeled or marginalized. Not to say that they won’t but they will be lying. I mean go ahead and tell anybody that main ingredients in these shots cross the blood brain barrier.
Having said that, I am totally in on trying to figure out how credibly narrate the incredible. There are plenty of signals but a lot of denial to work through.February 17, 2022 at 1:21 am #101681
kids never needed to take zoom classes; all of us would have been better off if they had caught covid from the start and developed immunity.
we have needlessly tortured a generation of children for two years.
one can easily find statistical evidence of the harm it has done.
as to masking adults, ¿why is it that our so-called “leaders” only seem to need a mask for certain photo ops?
what a scam..February 17, 2022 at 1:22 am #101682
“No, I have commented on the westerners in humanity, not all of humanity and nowhere near a majority.”
True, and also a clutched pearl, obviously. Replace “bulk of” with ‘a whole big bunch of’, if we must pick that nit (even though we both know that Chinese are functionally as “western” as westerners, just with added older flavors plus new ones like lingering Communist Party issues. You are, if anything, displaying here some kind of chauvinism and/or bigotry. Regardless, China/Japan have taken Westerndom and injected it into their social DNA for many decades now).
“I would certainly consider that as a contribution, but it is so obvious that I didn’t bother.”*1
But then, “retards”, only used as a slur these days, is inappropriate. They’re victims of circumstance just like you and me. Some of us are luckier than others in all kinds of different ways. No two people have the same circumstances. Development in youth is crucial to intellectual (and emotional) capacity.
But let’s just call them retards because… on second thought, let’s not. It’s just mean and arrogant, like how you tore into Sumac.carol a few days ago.
“The best way to address this is to use a conventional algorithm which limits the actions of the AI analysis. .”
This just prolongs the time before rigid logic-bound analog modeling by computation is unable to follow the veerings of humanity, which runs on faulty logic and incomplete data, while the AI suffers only incomplete data (assuming quality programming). They inevitably diverge.
Now, if HUMANS practice the restraint you say and regularly ‘rewind’ the AI before it gets too far off, that is HUMAN decision-making not AI decision-making which, as you explained to us, “is a form of mathematical modelling used to guide decision making: this decision making is not the same as humanity’s decision making” to which, returning the favor of your dismissive remark*1, I reply, “Please tell us something that we don’t already know already.”
“When AI “misreads humanity”, as you call it, the most common cause is that it was never trained with the required data to provide a statistically valuable analysis, and as AI has no “common sense” (as there is no cognition involved) it is unable to work out a reasonable versus unreasonable response.”
It is a typical human error to think that such complete data can be assembled, without which AIs inevitably proceed from brilliant height to higher peak only to suddenly fall in its own self-created landslide.
Humans, however, working with constantly incomplete and shifting data, generally don’t do this unless they’re really messed in the head like a socio/narco-psychopath.
It’s a matter of rigidity (AI )vs. flexibility (humans).February 17, 2022 at 1:42 am #101684
“Me I’m more insecure and suffer when criticised especially by people I admire – you Dr D, Raul, others here…”
Oxy, have I ever criticized you in a deliberately insulting or dismissive manner? Without being provoked first by the same? I don’t remember doing so, but I am known for coming on strong, and that alone can be intimidating and be misconstrued as negative. Do tell me if I have, and if so, I would surely make apology.
Like Doc D, I go through times when my brain and heart run so fast they get ahead of each other.
That said, let me state for the record that I am one of those guys who doesn’t overlook a sleight, cuz where there’s stink there’s shit, and it’s best to stop it while the fellow’s still just farting. It’s a matter of personal and group hygiene. But sometimes I mistake the smell of my upper lip for someone else’s feces, and make an ass of myself.
Do let me know, ‘k?February 17, 2022 at 1:51 am #101685
mr. trudeau’s district manager: https://www.weforum.org/people/chrystia-freelandFebruary 17, 2022 at 1:52 am #101686
“I never really need to (should never) go there” (vakzine conspiracy theory data) when discussing this with a true believer vaccinator type.”
It tends to be counter-productive. When that much cognitive dissonance is fueling their denial, gentler is way-y-y better.
“Having said that, I am totally in on trying to figure out how credibly narrate the incredible. There are plenty of signals but a lot of denial to work through.”
The question being a paradox, the answers are likely to be also? But, I confess, I’ve given up on it. But this seems to be very effective: “I am SO sick of wearing these masks.”
They agree with that. And if they follow with,
“But covid, do the right thing, etc.”, you don’t have to even disagree with them, just say, “I’m not saying that. I’m just saying that I’m SICK of wearing these masks, aren’t you?” Sidestep dispute straight into sympatico.
Since mostly unconscious irrationality is a major driver of public compliance, perhaps mostly physical irrational discomfort is a major wedge to drive into ol’ Vlad the Injector’s Draculoid heart?February 17, 2022 at 1:53 am #101687
tdk: Ms. Freeland has a smile that smells toxically narcissistic to me.February 17, 2022 at 1:57 am #101688
this is only reply that should be given to deflationista if it ever has the courage to rear its shameless head here again:February 17, 2022 at 2:00 am #101689
“But covid, do the right thing, etc.”, you don’t have to even disagree with them, just say, “I’m not saying that. I’m just saying that I’m SICK of wearing these masks, aren’t you?” Sidestep dispute straight into sympatico.”
You can also go aggressive:
“But covid, do the right thing…”
“Am I not wearing a mask? Am I not incompliance. Am I not doing the right thing?”
“Well, all I’m saying is that I’m SICK of wearing these icky smelly hot hard-to-talk-through<>hard-to-breathe-through masks. That’s all. I’m fucking sick.and.tired.of wearing a mask. Is that a crime?”February 17, 2022 at 2:05 am #101691V. ArnoldParticipant
Get out while you can; but, where to go is not clear…
I think the best bet is a non-Western country, where you don’t speak the language, and where most human interaction is with people you know personally. V. Arnold, I might join you down in Thailand. The Korean countryside would be OK, but city living here in Seoul is becoming too expensive, and living with 25 million neighbors is not good for the nerves. My first choice would be Nong Khai on the Laos border. Great memories of that hamlet . . .
Come on down…
One good thing about Nong Khai is it is just across the Mehkong river from Vientiane; a great city to explore…
As to Thailand being “too repressive”; nonsense. Spoken by someone who has not spent time here. I’ve lived here through 2 military coups and wouldn’t have known if I hadn’t read the news…
Far more personal freedom than the U.S. and friendly, smiling, police who won’t murder you for a burned out tail light.
The language is daunting but doable…plus, Thai’s light up if you speak to them in their language; it’s a lot of fun…I speak enough that I could take my sister to tourist spots and shopping without my wife to translate (she had to work). I am still learning after 19 years here…February 17, 2022 at 2:16 am #101692
Understood with the comment about the kids, but that speaks to a different issue. Speaking from personal experience, the kids here would rather be in school wearing masks than sitting at home without a mask and connecting by Zoom. The kids have plenty of time to play at home after school with other kids in a maskless environment. If the message from the parents is that it is normal and common sense to wear a mask in schools, the kids adjust just fine. If the message from the parents is that this is scarring you for life, then I fear it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.”
I think those are some excellent considerations to keep in mind.
“Bottom line: This is the real life clinical trial. There are 25 million people in greater Seoul, and almost all have complied with widespread masking. We never had a lockdown. People always went along with their normal routines, except that the size of gatherings in restaurants was limited. I am convinced that widespread masking is a big factor, and I have not heard a better explanation. I look at the other major cities in Asia, and compare those to the major cities in the West, and there is an obvious difference in behaviors and outcomes. I think that is undeniable, but I also recognize that nobody in the West wants to see what I see.”
As for mask efficacy, I tend to agree with your assertion that they aren’t useless. They are neither useless nor fully protective.
Sadly, they have been mostly used to create an environment of medical meaningless and political straitjacketing, so it’s almost impossible to discuss them of themselves anymore. Not only cuz people are so touchy about it, but because those other issues are now inextricably wound up in the concept of ‘protective mask’.
But it would be nice if we weren’t dumping a few hundred million masks a day into landfills and oceans. A few hundred million here, a few there, pretty soon you’re talking real pollution.February 17, 2022 at 2:23 am #101693
@TDK Now we are starting to find common ground. I agree that this has gone on too long. From the beginning, the priority should have been to study repurposed drugs that might be used for early treatment. China was doing small chloroquine phosphate trials in January 2020! Favorable ivermectin studies were coming out in mid-2020. Once we had reasonable treatment protocols, economies should have started reopening. Instead, Western governments insisted on waiting for a vaccine and novel/expensive new treatments (and Korea being a US vassal state went along with it). The refusal to consider early treatments, and the persecution of physicians who spoke out in favor of early treatments: This was the crime against humanity. This is why Fauci and friends should be in jail.
Yes, it has gone on too long. It was not only mismanaged, but the response has been a criminal enterprise. But my point is that masks were never the problem, and it was always wrong to say “masks don’t work.” They were always part of the solution, especially in the beginning when we needed to slow the spread for the first six months, which was the time required to identify early treatment protocols.February 17, 2022 at 2:39 am #101694
Reviewing recent data and Biden’s more recent remarks re: Russia/Ukraine, I would guess that the gobmynt gonna do some infrastructure cyberattack and holler RussiaRussiaRussia again.
Since the gubmint can no longer bully people abroad, it is of course our turn. I wonder how long we’ll take it. I wonder how long we’ll remain a UnitedSA. Not if we’ll break up, just how soon. It seems mighty nigh of late. THe next presidential election, if not the mid-terms, should do it?February 17, 2022 at 2:39 am #101695D Benton SmithParticipant
@chooch gamely wrote “. . . Having said that , I am totally in on trying to figure out how to credibly narrate the incredible. ”
Same here. One of the reasons that I invest so much time consuming vast quantities of other people’s descriptions of these extremely complex and lengthy issues is to find out how THEY have explained them. From time to time I manage to learn bits and pieces from their brilliantly concise and eloquent translations of hyper-complexity into “understandable by us mere mortals” simplicity. Over time, I do believe that some of it is starting to sink in.February 17, 2022 at 2:46 am #101696
2 & 1/2 minutes of Jordan Peterson talking about the Ottawa trucker phenom:February 17, 2022 at 2:55 am #101697
Oops. I wrote “KInd” instead of ‘King’, the word I really meant. But how insensitive of me not to acknowledge The Glory.
“Of course, you’re not expressing your EGO when anointing yourselfKind of What Should and Shouldn’t Be Done.”February 17, 2022 at 2:56 am #101698
I thought I saw this posted here but maybe not. It’s brief and shows hope.February 17, 2022 at 3:29 am #101699
Some happy news!
Today the sap started running in my sugar maple tree here in Toronto!
I figure I have so far collected from my 3 tap operation, about 1/2″ in the first orange juice container, about 1″ in the second, and 2″ in the third, for maybe 2 to 3 cups of sap!
Boiled down by 1/32, I probably have about a table spoon of maple syrup! I’m rich!
It isn’t going to freeze tonight but I doubt the sap will run onight without sunlight. Below freezing temperatures arrive at noon tomorrow so my sap operation will be shutdown until Sunday and Monday when it the sap should start running again for another 2 days.
After that my maple sap operation will likely be shutdown for an extended period of colder than normal weather, until sometime after March 2nd.
O.K. I am only going to get rich very slowly!
And if I ever figure out the photo posting thing, thanks Bosco and Doc Robinson, I will post a photo of my huge 3 tap maple syrup operation!
Wow! You sure look like a modern lumberjack!
I wouldn’t be too surprised if all the trees, in your neck of the woods, start running when they see you a coming!February 17, 2022 at 3:38 am #101700VietnamVetParticipant
Invasion Day Wednesday, February 16, 2022, has come and gone in Ukraine with no Russian Invasion. The Russian Foreign Minister has a reason to laugh at the West. The CDC says excess deaths in the last two years in the USA surpassed 1 million but may be even more if insurance losses for life insurance payouts are real. The US government is a complete failure. Nothing it says can be believed.
Canada points the way to the coming western dystopian future. Any surviving middle-class with bank accounts will have assets frozen or fines imposed if one’s social credit score drops below set amounts. For example, a fall from 600 to 500 for bad mouthing the PM will cost 10,000 Loonies.
The craziness is spreading across all five-eye nations. The only way I can explain it is that the western democracies were terminated. The Blob, a couple thousand oligarchs and their overseers, reign in a neo-feudal corporate/state — a 21st century version of Mussolini’s fascist organization. Except, no one dares admit it. The only way out is a general strike and the restoration of democracy. The tragedy is that there is election process to do this system restoration peacefully but the western ruling cult will never agree to it voluntarily and they have wealth and power.February 17, 2022 at 3:38 am #101701
I see Canada’s federal justice minister said if you are a Canadian Trump supporter, I would be worried. Obviously, the liberals don’t want to waste a good crisis.
So now we know Trudeau is going to use the war measures act to also go after Trump supporters and seize their bank accounts too!
So this is really purely no-holds political operation against conservative Canadians.
It has nothing to do with public health, or safety, or the vaccines!February 17, 2022 at 3:53 am #101702oxymoronParticipant
Bosco na I didn’t communicate clearly. I’ve never been slighted here and you came down hard on me once and it was hugely beneficial.February 17, 2022 at 3:55 am #101703Tim GrovesParticipant
“No, it’s not the kimchee. No, it’s not the sweet and sour pork. No, it is not the sushi. No, it’s not even the chili crab. It’s the masks.”
Really? Don’t you think the green tea, the seaweed, and the ginseng have something to do with it? Or the relatively low consumption levels of various legal and illegal drugs in East Asia? And more importantly, don’t you think the hugely lower rates of obesity in East Asia and the co-related hugely lower rates of diabetes, heart disease and cancer relative to the West have anything to do with it?
Don’t you think that food choices and dietary habits have any effect on obesity levels?
Here in Japan, people were masks all the time, including paper ones that a bumblebee could enter from above on the left side of the nose and exit on the right side, and cute homemade cloth ones fashioned out from recycled kitchen or bathroom towel materials that are nowhere near adequate to prevent viral transmission but that demonstrate the wearer’s community spirit.
Very often, Japanese people will put on a mask to walk through the door into a café or restaurant, then take it off when they sit down, so they spend twenty of thirty minutes unmasked in a room that may be filled with a dozen or more unmasked strangers.
But amazingly, these masks work to prevent Corona-chan from spreading, even when they are not being worn?
Possibly they do, but there are a lot of other factors that need to be taken into account before coming to that conclusion. For instance, it is possible that the higher population densities in East Asia ensure that most people’s immune systems get more practice fighting off germs of all kinds, which keeps them in good condition. But at the same time, you are what you eat, and the standard American “Walmart” and fast food diet is producing a lot of obese people, contributing to poor health and lowering life expectancy. Why shouldn’t it also be playing a role in producing poor Covid-19 outcomes and poor Covid 19 vaccine-related outcomes?
Just checking the statistics, life expectancy for Japanese in 2021 was 84.79 years, a 0.14% increase from 2020, when it was 84.67 years, a 0.14% increase from 2019. The South Koreans are only a year below the Japanese and the Taiwanese are also living beyond 80 on the average. Meanwhile, life expectancy for people in the U.S. in 2020 was 77.0 years, a decrease of 1.8 years from 2019. So the Japanese are now living a full 10% longer than the Americans. Even the mainland Chinese have caught up with the Americans, living almost 77 years on the average in 2019—despite starting from a very low base half a century ago and living with the pollution that pervades the country and the oppression and coercion that pervades the society.
Can we put these life expectancy statistics down solely or mainly or even substantially down to mask wearing, or are they the result of a complex interplay of many other factors? And if the later, then why can’t this same complex interplay be resulting in poor outcomes from Covid-19?February 17, 2022 at 3:59 am #101704
I think Russia forgot to invade today! The CIA and State department must be pretty upset about this!
I agree, the 5 eyes are being co-ordinated by one power. The trucker protest has clearly revealed this aspect, for all to see. Unfortunately most Canadians do not want to see. They prefer to remain brainwashed.
7February 17, 2022 at 4:07 am #101705
From my favorite (well funded) vaccinator, Mr. Topol. Montefiori just became a person of interest.
Why would an updated Omicron specific jab provide no additional benefit vs original? Many comments in this thread but no good answer.
“What we’re seeing coming out of these preclinical studies in animal models is that a boost with a variant vaccine doesn’t really do any better than a boost with the current vaccine,” says David Montefiori, director of the Laboratory for AIDS Vaccine Research and Development at Duke University Medical Center in Durham, North Carolina, who has been studying COVID-19 vaccines.
— Eric Topol (@EricTopol) February 15, 2022February 17, 2022 at 4:10 am #101706
Is the monitoring of CO2 levels in buildings common in Japan?February 17, 2022 at 4:10 am #101707Doc RobinsonParticipant
WES: “I will post a photo…”
I should have mentioned (in my earlier instructions) to not use those free hosting services for any photos that have commercial value or privacy issues. I think the terms and conditions stipulate something about the hosting service getting the rights to use the images for whatever.February 17, 2022 at 4:13 am #101708
Very good comment!
But you forgot we have to contend with dr fauci and his evil gang running (ruining) our health.
They easily knock 5 years off our life expectancy.February 17, 2022 at 4:16 am #101709
Thanks, Doc Robinson, for the warning!February 17, 2022 at 4:19 am #101710
uh, that’s properly called “baric’s baby”.
i do like “fauci’s ouchie”, too.
“daszak’s ballsack” is a little too creepy.February 17, 2022 at 4:24 am #101711ctbarnumParticipant
Just tired today, so apologies for my limited soliloquy. That said, seems more and more like Trudeau is just Hillary Clinton with a penis.
SHOCK VIDEO: Conservative MP @MelissaLantsman, a Jewish woman and descendent of Holocaust survivors asks @JustinTrudeau for an apology for claiming she stands with swastikas. Trudeau had left the House of Commons when the apology was asked for. Trudeau must apologize. #cdnpoli pic.twitter.com/L67MoFvwAP
— Brian Lilley (@brianlilley) February 16, 2022February 17, 2022 at 4:35 am #101712
Trudeau has already said he has no intentions of apologizing!
He is not one who ever says he is sorry for what he did.
He is never sorry.February 17, 2022 at 4:42 am #101713February 17, 2022 at 5:01 am #101714D Benton SmithParticipant
@ctbarnum lamented, “Just tired today, so apologies for my limited soliloquy. That said, seems more and more like Trudeau is just Hillary Clinton with a penis.”
Justin Trudeau has a penis ?!February 17, 2022 at 5:25 am #101715Figmund SreudParticipantFebruary 17, 2022 at 5:29 am #101716Tim GrovesParticipant
“Is the monitoring of CO2 levels in buildings common in Japan?”
I’m not sure if it is common, as I haven’t been going very far afield for the past couple of years, but as it happens, I adopted a Siamese cat (who suffers from bladder stones and slurry due to metabolic issues) and I’ve been taking him the only veterinarian I knew of who was competent to the surgery required to allow him to keep urinating. Fun fact: According to the vet, the urethra of male domestic cats has a diameter of around 6mm but it tapers to as narrow as 1mm at the tip of the penis!
In the waiting room of this vet, where I have spent quite a few happy hours, I noticed that there was a device that simultaneously displays the temperature, barometric pressure, humidity level, and CO2 level on a small gray/black LCD. I’ve seen the CO2 level vary from about 500 ppm when there are only two or three people present, to as high as 1,400 ppm when the waiting room gets crowded. Also, the staff will open some windows when the level goes up, as this usually coincides with the room feeling stuffy.February 17, 2022 at 7:04 am #101717
I agree that co-morbidities are certainly relevant to disease outcomes. But I have not seen any data suggesting that co-morbidities have any effect on infection rates.
Quite the contrary, from my understanding, we are all going to catch this sooner or later: young and old, rich and poor, fat and thin, healthy and unhealthy, vaccinated and unvaccinated. The co-morbidities become a factor in whether a person is likely to have a severe case.
I agree that obesity is one of the most important co-morbidities, and obesity is more prevalent in Western countries. Diet may be generally better in Asia, but Asia has its own co-morbidities, particularly Vitamin D deficiency, which is also closely linked to bad Covid outcomes. Another issue in Asia is air pollution, and which is terrible in Seoul — maybe not so bad in Tokyo.February 17, 2022 at 7:40 am #101718
I’ve lived here through 2 military coups and wouldn’t have known if I hadn’t read the news…
That might be the antidote to all the madness. My Korean is good enough to get by, but not good enough to follow Korean politics. As Cypher says in The Matrix: “Ignorance is bliss.”
I follow all that is happening in the US and overseas, but the only reason I can cope is that it is happening thousands of miles away.
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