Debt Rattle May 1 2021

 

Home Forums The Automatic Earth Forum Debt Rattle May 1 2021

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  • #74279
    greco
    Participant

    Consider the Pfizers, how they grow: they toil not, neither do they spin; yet I say unto you, Even Solomon in all his glory was not arraigned like one of these.
    To see the rap sheet of this group, go HERE. then ask yourself when taking the shot, am I feeling lucky?

    #74280
    Bill7
    Participant

    > “..You just “let them win” since communism destroys itself <

    Adding: I’d be interested in that commenter’s definition of communism, because what’s being inflicted on 90+% of us sure doesn’t look like comm’nism to me.

    When powerful private entities become influential enough to dictate to gubmint;
    or, especially, when those two entities meld for private gain benefitting the very few,
    I call that Fascism, Fascism, Fascism.

    How’re Bezos Gates Soros Blankfein Dimon et al doing lately, compared to the many? BTW: Healthcare™ and Banking™ entities scored record-breaking profits since the “pandemic” started.. doesn’t the former, in particular, seem just a little odd?
    Would’t those Billions in premiums raked in by the Very Few have had to be spent treating all the pandemic™ victims?

    #74281
    Bill7
    Participant

    phoenixvoice: thank you for your comment today about being helped to get on your
    feet through government programs.

    #74282
    Mister Roboto
    Participant

    When powerful private entities become influential enough to dictate to gubmint;
    or, especially, when those two entities meld for private gain benefitting the very few,
    I call that Fascism, Fascism, Fascism.

    Classic European Fascism (which is not the same thing as right-wing authoritarianism ala Franco and Pinochet) and Statist Communism actually do have things in common. Curiously, even though Fascism is fundamentally irrational at its ideological core, Communism is more irrational in its dogmatism about how the economy is supposed to be run. And that’s probably the big thing that did it in.

    #74283
    madamski
    Participant

    My simplified view of the fascism/communism similarity divide is that communism is fascism without capitalism. Communism’s idealism forbids declared evil-as-greed in its ethos, which is impossible in any large society. Fascism allows evil-as-greed to exist, indeed, glorifies it, and so runs longer but into the same brick wall and just as disastrously.

    Both depend on money in some form, and money is inherently unstable and prone to severe evil since it is magical without honoring anything but itself. Dark magic indeed.

    #74284
    Bill7
    Participant

    > Classic European Fascism (which is not the same thing as right-wing authoritarianism ala Franco and Pinochet) and Statist Communism actually do have things in common. Curiously, even though Fascism is fundamentally irrational at its ideological core, Communism is more irrational in its dogmatism about how the economy is supposed to be run. And that’s probably the big thing that did it in. <

    With clear definitions of those three (?) Political Economies and their respective policies, conversation could be had.

    #74285
    madamski
    Participant

    The loss of in-person conviviances happened because of technology not some master plan.

    How we worship the wealthy! We grant them god-like status when they’re just exploitative manipulative jerks. The Stockholm syndrome is deep and powerful, so powerful it can make us revere our oppressors even when we know they’re awful, even when we know they see us only as things to exploit. We still want to believe they’re somehow responsible or competent, like the super-villains we see in cinema, that they at least keep a neat and clean secret underground laboratory kitchen floor.

    #74286
    Bill7
    Participant

    “we..”

    nice try!

    Read Illich, then note what’s been systematically destroyed: most all that he said
    was essential to the function of a decent civil society.

    Technology is not value-neutral; and did not arise ex nihilo, contrary to some claimants.

    “Oopsies! The Very Few just got vastly richer yet again! Oopsie oopsie oopsie, over and over and over and over and over and.. it’s a silly-ol accident! ” Illich, Ellul, Lippman, and Bernays told us what was going to be / was being done to us, and long ago..

    Nicholas Carr’s good, too, even if he pointedly refuses to draw conclusions from the facts he marshals so well in ‘The Shallows: What the Internet is Doing to Our Brains’.

    #74287
    madamski
    Participant

    @ Bill7

    “we..”

    “nice try!”

    Forgive me for not singling you out. I suppose you want the credit? Ok: you worship the wealthy and powerful, as do many others here, in the same manner that old school fire’n’brimstone Southern Baptist Bible thumpers worship Satan more than the God they claim to revere… because they believe in fear over hope.

    Yes, evil manipulators get wealthy and powerful taking advantage of good-intentioned people (Tesla comes to mind). I certainly don’t dispute that. I just dispute with your downright hard-on fearful reverence for the legends these people who, using now-standard Bernays tactics, use to convince people they’re not just clever amoral jerks but Evil Geniuses who can practically foresee the future (not unlike ye olde temple priests).

    Maybe they can. It’s possible. Maybe they’re from The Future. Maybe they’re Nephilim working for old Satan. They certainly WANT to rule the world. But where you see brilliant genii playing the planet like some boardcomputer game with deep vision, I just see scamsters using emerging events and technology to do more of the same old bullshit.

    We could be talking to our neighbors face to face rather than whining in here about how hard it is to talk to our neighbors because the disciples of Bernays make this internet so hypnotically mind-controlloing that, well, how could we ever hope to escape from the power of our magic screens? (THAT, by the way, is INSANE. But so are 99.999% of humanity. Oh well.)

    It’s so much easier to fight virtual bogeymen than actually do something outside the boxes they like us to stay in… and that we stay in so obligingly if grudgingly.

    Go ahead. Suck that big old Evil Genius Fear-Futility cock. Don’t you (not “we”, you) just LOVE that sperm of hopeless helplessness disguised as angry enlightened awareness of What’s Really Happening ™.Yummmm…. you do their work for them well and you’re (probably) not even paid. I don’t get it but everyone has their kinks, it seems.

    No, I don’t believe that the Great Mental Brainwarp Men who really rule our world (coming soon to a theater near you) didn’t plan for TV or newspapers or books or cuneiform or writing/reading or language to be invented… they just exploited it.

    Understand, sir, that you’re speaking to a silly woman who believes in guardian angels and heavenly afterlives and demiurges and gods and Gods and something some people call the Dao. Even that crazy old broad knows that the man who STEALS something that another man invented (Philo T. Farnsworth comes to mind) is not the man who envisioned it and planned what to do with it if it were invented.

    That would be something done by, you know, demons and demiurges and such. Crazy shit. So, if you’re saying that there’s a supernatural copnspiracy behind all this, I can roll with it even though it’s awfully comic book. But if you’re saying that this arises from natural human history, I’ve got a comic book version of the Bible I’d like to sell you. Jesus in a cape and tights and Satan in an even bigger cape (compensating for his insecurity, see?) and a pair of red scarlet short-shorts.

    Me, I try to deal with reality on the ground, where it happens. I keep my supernatural magical thinking where it belongs: in the sky, in my farthest imaginations, as a meta-explanation for thinks that can’t be explained by mundane logic, for example, crazy psycho-socio-narcissistic mutants who take advantage of how the rest of us can at least TRY to behave decently.

    Executive Responsibilities

    Gotta hand it to you, Bill7: you got my billy gruff’s goat. Trolls do that, I’m told. TOuche’.

    #74288
    madamski
    Participant

    ‘But so are 99.999% of humanity.’

    Let’s hear it for the .001%! The elites who own 99.999% of human sanity!

    #74289
    madamski
    Participant

    When the great Tao is forgotten,
    goodness and piety appear.
    When the body’s intelligence declines,
    cleverness and knowledge step forth.
    When there is no peace in the family,
    filial piety begins.
    When the country falls into chaos,
    patriotism is born.

    #74290
    sumac.carol
    Participant

    Phoenix voice thank you for speaking out about how the social welfare system has helped you and your family. Countries like the US with enough money to invade numerous other countries and transport people to explore the moon surely can put aside some money for basic needs of their country people’s families in their time of need. This is called charity and we will all need some at some point in our life.

    #74291
    Germ
    Participant

    Yup – the are now coming for our kids:

    “Secondary school pupils will be offered Covid-19 vaccinations from September under plans being developed by the NHS, according to The Sunday Times.” https://tinyurl.com/2v6feuyu

    #74302
    Dr. D
    Participant

    3/11 “With CDC release that masks don’t work: You read that correctly, they didn’t misplace the decimal: according to the federal government agency that is responsible for managing the COVID-1984 pandemic, the difference between mask mandates and no mask mandate is literally just a 1.32% difference.” https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/pdfs/mm7010e3-H.pdf

    Communism, etc. As Madam say, (and Gloria Estefan) the words get in the way. But she got it. Because: Human nature, they’re all actually similar, just the P.R. is different. In Capitalism as it’s used pejoratively, not strictly, the rich own everything and then own and bend the government to avoid criminal problems as well as running their will over the people. In Communism/Socialism, the government owns everything (and you own nothing, and are happy…or too scared to complain) and the Party insiders then CONTROL everything, bend the government to avoid criminal problems, and run roughshod over the desperate impoverished people. And in Fascism, they JOIN these two forces, where the corporations love their nation, and voluntarily unite with government to be stronger, and then the rich run everything and run roughshod over the people who are required to wave flags and love the government even in their hearts, INTERNALLY, turn in all their neighbors on social media peer pressure if they too do not love or follow the party line ENOUGH, or else they will all disappear and be murdered.

    Of the three, “Capitalism” – even in most pejorative interpretation – is still the least dangerous since it has the smallest government and most competition. You never know when Lehman may run afoul and be erased, or you can consistently weaken the NBA by not watching. Government has to hide and pretend they’re not forcing you to undergo medical experiments, but leave loopholes because they’re “voluntary”. Obviously, even “Capitalism” isn’t our system, according to our primary laws, now not followed or enforced lo these 100 (150?) years. Constitutional capitalism would be enormously smaller, and following a founder’s interpretation, Corporations WOULDN’T EXIST, because they would need a state charter to get a business license, at which Congressional Testimony would have to explain why their corporation is expressly and solely for the good of the people, then be licensed for 10 years only, or to disband when they built that bridge. We’re not in that system, but it’s STILL better. And like, history doesn’t show you this with 100 million people killed by Socialism, or National Socialism? C’mon, you know this stuff.

    Besides, “Capitalism” is not supposed to be your God, never was, never should be. God should be your God, and family should be your family, and community should be your focus, doing work and savings just pays the bills. Somehow they’re determined to use a screwdriver as a hammer and not notice while blaming the toolbox, not the workman.

    My point was they work tirelessly – using government, and your taxes, both direct and diverted via government-authorized monopoly – to utterly destroy all of us on God, Family, Community end. For 100 years chewing away, using my own hard work to undermine me/us. They did this first experiment with natives, and it destroyed them, so they moved to blacks and minorities, and it destroyed them, and now it’s rolled out society-wide. I don’t know where you get race from since the most # of such are whites, and equally poor rural whites.

    Look at before and after: Before, social services come from your FAMILY, your church, your community, other workers, other wives in your town. Everyone has small-time jobs, small time coin to help a brother. This goes back to the Middle Ages, but we’re talking Johnson here. Like health care, they then want to nationalize all this under a larger government. And it works – of COURSE it does, that’s the hook – but only for WHILE. Government taking it over means churches close down, clubs close down, charities close down, since they’ve been undercut, priced out of business, while donors all stop, since they’re already paying – REQUIRED to donate, at gunpoint – to a larger charity they don’t want. They don’t have the dough now anyway, since they’re been taxed. But so what, if it works?

    Fast forward: church gone, family gone, business gone, small-change friends in community gone, charity gone, as HAD TO happen, as predicted would happen. People adjusted to the new reality. Government = charity. We go there. And then? Government becomes an idiotic bureaucracy, completely unresponsive, using (Not making this up) 50% of the donation money on themselves to get just 50% welfare to the people. And if you don’t like it, you can’t stop it. You can’t donate somewhere to someone that solves homelessness or actually gets people off welfare, as statistically, they completely never do.

    CAN they help? Sure, of course. In the corners, smart motivated people are still able to use the system the way it was sold. But it takes relentless drive. People I know have. But the system has now overtaken US, the people, our family connections and responsibilities, our own self-help.

    What would have happened in 1950 instead? Well, bunches of things. First they would all have piped up about who you were marrying. And that guy (and gal) would have had five chaperones and a gauntlet of approvals to run through family, stories about whether they were productive or lazy, abusive or supportive, all of that. You could know him/her by their life-long clubs and those friends. Next, suppose something went wrong: you’ve got your family, HIS family, the peer pressure of everyone at church, the pastor, all laying it on you. He can’t go anywhere without his friends looking cross-eyed at him not being a man. Other guys, forced to stand up, would be annoyed HE isn’t forced to stand up.

    Next level, problems start. There ain’t no government, people: work it out. So your brother, father, cousin, make up some excuse to go drinking with him, then pin him down in an alley, give him two black eyes, and tell him to shape up or he won’t be lucky. We’re not kidding. Charities start. You go off your a friend’s house who will put you up, call in charity X and Y, when the real charity is somebody you know fits you in a job you’re probably not all that good for, AS a charity to you, and you rise to the occasion and work, develop a new life. That only happens because everybody’s working small-time, local business, sole proprietor. You use that money to join the woman’s auxiliary, which like all clubs provides a doctor on call – health care – as part of collective dues.

    He either shapes up or you ship out to a new life.

    All of that was totally, completely annihilated by government, and now you can file paperwork, wait ten weeks, NOT get a house when he’s violent, not have enough to eat, then later, when papers come through, you’re not allowed to work – ever – because working in the slightest, leaving daddy social services pimp, means they will instantly and with prejudice cut off all your income and health care, evict you, and possibly even demand you pay them back. …You know, ‘cause you tried a minimum wage hustle on the side that made $50/week. That’s worse than the most controlling husbands. It’s straight abuse and I’ve seen it. All over. The system is god-d—ned psychotic on the poorest and weakest and most damaged. So sure, yes, some people can use it, but look at the two side-by-side. They say homelessness can be solved for $60B (false, complicated, but okay), well the mere WASTE in the existing system could cure that. AND you’ve destroyed the family, the charity, the community, and the church. They HAD charity back then and always. MORE of it than now, better delivered.

    Look at the National Health. At first, it goes great. But then, like all programs, it develops sclerosis, a bureaucracy, and starts wasting vast sums, not responsive. Eventually, the waste and change leads to “we’re broke”, and the “broke” is no longer this ONE thing, it’s the whole government, and because of same, the whole society. So Doctor, Government, Business, and Family are all broke at the SAME TIME, since you merged them all. They fight valiantly, sucking up all resources with tax rates and rules, install poverty and oppression, but fail anyway. Like the Soviets in 1990. Then guess what? You have NO health care, no police, no safety, no courts, no economy, AND no prosperity. It all was wasted in the 50% welfare bureaucracy put our on $40T debt, and now has to be built all over again. P.S. while the richest still and always live on palatial Dachas, that part never changes. NHS and all Britain is presently collapsing, as is Europe for the same thing, and they don’t even pay their military. We do. Yes, it all works…until you run out of other people’s money. Mine.

    I’d rather the failures come one area at a time, not all at once, and I’m not willing to vote myself free health care so my KIDS can enjoy a certain collapse in their old age. I’ll take the work and responsibility of men day by day, as it comes. That way I have the cash set aside to help a friend that needs me.

    P.S. don’t know how Vietnam is related, except they paid them at the same time. It was both what done it. That was to wrest the government away from the people and to the banks/corporations, by inventing an unnecessary and unpayable debt. Nixon then admitted it was unpayable by defaulting, and here we are. That’s why Vietnam had no point, and made no sense. It wasn’t supposed to. It was supposed to waste money, lose, and install fascism, which it mostly did.

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