Mar 052020
 


DPC Mott Street, Chinatown, New York c1900

 

Wuhan Coronavirus Infections Spike (R.)
Chinese Scientists Identify Two Strains Of The Coronavirus (CNBC)
On The Origin And Continuing Evolution Of SARS-CoV-2 (NSR)
Official US Coronavirus Numbers Are Wrong, and Everyone Knows It (Atl.)
Flybe, Europe’s Largest Regional Airline, Collapses (G.)
California-Based Cruise Ship Quarantined Off Pacific Coast (Pol.)
Purell For $400? US Lawmaker Urges Amazon To Tamp Down Price Gouging (R.)
The Greatest Victory Of The Establishment Since The Defeat Of The Huns (Turley)
Moscow’s Difficult Decision on Idlib (Lawrence)
Russia Reinforces Syria Before Putin-Erdogan Talks (R.)
Tens Of Thousands Blocked At Greek-Turkey Border (K.)
Greece’s Economic ‘Recovery’ Good News For No One But The Rich (Varoufakis)
Half Of Greek Families Still Cite Pensions As Their Main Source Of Income (K.)

 

 

 

Cases 95,880 (+ 4.563 from Tuesday’s 91,317)

Deaths 3,288 (+ 168 from Tuesday’s 3,120)

 

• Fittingly, No Time To Die was postponed

• Biggest news: Scientists find two different corona strains. So what is everyone exactly testing for, at least those that do testing?

• Italy to close all schools and universities, cinemas and theaters, all sports games behind closed doors.
– 587 new cases, 3,089 cases in total, 1,346 hospitalized, 107 deaths, 295 in intensive care

• South Korea 435 new cases, 4 more deaths, 60% linked to Shincheonji church; 136,000 tests

• CDC’s Dr. Fauci said 15-20% of infected people need hospitalization. Britain has 15 beds for worst cases. How many does US have?

• California declares state of emergency, follows WA, FL
– cruise ship stuck off coast

• France 28 new cases, total to 285. 8 deaths.

• UK cases up 34 to 85 – 66% surge.

• Netherlands 40 cases

• Greece 10 cases

• First airline collapses, Flybe, Europe’s largest regional airline

290 million children worldwide locked out of school.
– 13 countries closed all schools, among them Italy, China, Japan, Iran. 9 others have reginal closures, US, Germany, France and more

• “On Tuesday, Ford Motor Company, which employs nearly 200,000 people, told workers to stop all international and U.S. domestic air travel..”

 

From SCMP:

 

 

From Worldometer (Note: mortality rate at 6%):

 

 

From COVID2019.app:

 

 

 

 

All is good.

Wuhan Coronavirus Infections Spike (R.)

Mainland China reported a rise in new confirmed cases of coronavirus on Thursday, reversing three straight days of declines, because of a spike in new infections in Wuhan, the city at the center of the outbreak. Mainland China had 139 new confirmed cases as of Wednesday, the National Health Commission (NHC) said, bringing the total accumulated number of cases to 80,409. Authorities reported 119 new cases the previous day and 125 the day before that. The increase was driven by more cases in Wuhan, the provincial capital of Hubei, where the virus is believed to have emerged in a market late last year.

Wuhan’s new infections climbed to 131 from 114 a day earlier. There was no immediate elaboration and health officials were due to hold a briefing later in the day. After what some critics said was an initially hesitant response to the new virus, China imposed sweeping restrictions to try to stop it, including transport suspensions, lockdowns of cities and extending a Lunar New Year holiday across the country. WHO officials have said other countries have much to learn from the way China has handled the outbreak and Vice Foreign Minister Ma Zhaoxu said many countries had asked for help and China was responding.

The number of new confirmed cases in Hubei, excluding Wuhan, has remained in single digits for seven consecutive days, with three new infections recorded on Wednesday. In the rest of mainland China, outside Hubei, there were only five new confirmed cases, the health commission said. The death toll from the outbreak in mainland China had reached 3,012 as of the end of Wednesday, up by 31 from the previous day. Hubei accounted for all of the new deaths. In Wuhan, 23 people died. With the downward trend in new cases, Chinese authorities have turned their attention to stopping the virus being brought in from new coronavirus hot spots abroad.

Read more …

A remarkably bland version of the story.

Chinese Scientists Identify Two Strains Of The Coronavirus (CNBC)

Researchers in China have found that two different types of the new coronavirus could be causing infections worldwide. In a preliminary study published Tuesday, scientists at Peking University’s School of Life Sciences and the Institut Pasteur of Shanghai found that a more aggressive type of the new coronavirus had accounted for roughly 70% of analyzed strains, while 30% had been linked to a less aggressive type. The more aggressive type of virus was found to be prevalent in the early stages of the outbreak in Wuhan — the Chinese city where COVID-19 was first detected late last year. But the frequency of this type of virus has since decreased from early January.


The researchers said their results indicate the development of new variations of the spike in COVID-19 cases was “likely caused by mutations and natural selection besides recombination.” “These findings strongly support an urgent need for further immediate, comprehensive studies that combine genomic data, epidemiological data, and chart records of the clinical symptoms of patients with coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19),” they said. Researchers cautioned that data examined in the study was still “very limited,” emphasizing that follow-up studies of a larger set of data would be needed to gain a “better understanding” of the evolution and epidemiology of COVID-19.

Read more …

This is more like it. But again, what are we testing for, if we are testing at all? Are all tests exactly the same? And then: do they cover both strains?

On The Origin And Continuing Evolution Of SARS-CoV-2 (NSR)

The SARS-CoV-2 epidemic started in late December 2019 in Wuhan, China, and has since impacted a large portion of China and raised major global concern. Herein, we investigated the extent of molecular divergence between SARS-CoV-2 and other related coronaviruses. Although we found only 4% variability in genomic nucleotides between SARS-CoV-2 and a bat SARS-related coronavirus (SARSr-CoV; RaTG13), the difference at neutral sites was 17%, suggesting the divergence between the two viruses is much larger than previously estimated.


Our results suggest that the development of new variations in functional sites in the receptor-binding domain (RBD) of the spike seen in SARS-CoV-2 and viruses from pangolin SARSr-CoVs are likely caused by mutations and natural selection besides recombination. Population genetic analyses of 103 SARS-CoV-2 genomes indicated that these viruses evolved into two major types (designated L and S), that are well defined by two different SNPs that show nearly complete linkage across the viral strains sequenced to date. Although the L type (<±70%) is more prevalent than the S type (<±30%), the S type was found to be the ancestral version.

Whereas the L type was more prevalent in the early stages of the outbreak in Wuhan, the frequency of the L type decreased after early January 2020. Human intervention may have placed more severe selective pressure on the L type, which might be more aggressive and spread more quickly. On the other hand, the S type, which is evolutionarily older and less aggressive, might have increased in relative frequency due to relatively weaker selective pressure. These findings strongly support an urgent need for further immediate, comprehensive studies that combine genomic data, epidemiological data, and chart records of the clinical symptoms of patients with coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19).

Read more …

Because no testing.

Official US Coronavirus Numbers Are Wrong, and Everyone Knows It (Atl.)

We know, irrefutably, one thing about the coronavirus in the United States: The number of cases reported in every chart and table is far too low. The data are untrustworthy because the processes we used to get them were flawed. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention’s testing procedures missed the bulk of the cases. They focused exclusively on travelers, rather than testing more broadly, because that seemed like the best way to catch cases entering the country. Just days ago, it was not clear that the virus had spread solely from domestic contact at all. But then cases began popping up with no known international connection. What public-health experts call “community spread” had arrived in the United States. The virus would not be stopped by tight borders, because it was already propagating domestically.

Trevor Bedford’s lab at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle, which studies viral evolution, concluded there is “firm evidence” that, at least in Washington State, the coronavirus had been spreading undetected for weeks. Now different projections estimate that 20 to 1,500 people have already been infected in the greater Seattle area. In California, too, the disease appears to be spreading, although the limited testing means that no one is quite sure how far. In total, fewer than 500 people have been tested across the country (although the CDC has stopped reporting that number in its summary of the outbreak). As a result, the current “official” case count inside the United States stood at 43 as of [Tuesday] morning (excluding cruise-ship cases). This number is wrong, yet it’s still constantly printed and quoted. In other contexts, we’d call this what it is: a subtle form of misinformation.

This artificially low number means that for the past few weeks, we’ve seen massive state action abroad and only simmering unease domestically. While Chinese officials were enacting a world-historic containment effort—putting more than 700 million people under some kind of movement restriction, quarantining tens of millions of people, and placing others under new kinds of surveillance—and American public-health officials were staring at the writing on the wall that the disease was extremely likely to spread in the U.S., the public-health response was stuck in neutral. The case count in the U.S. was not increasing at all. Preparing for a sizable outbreak seemed absurd when there were fewer than 20 cases on American soil. Now we know that the disease was already spreading and that it was the U.S. response that was stalled.

Read more …

There’s more where that came from.

Flybe, Europe’s Largest Regional Airline, Collapses (G.)

Flybe, Europe’s largest regional airline, has collapsed into administration less than two months after the government announced a rescue deal. The impact of the coronavirus on flight bookings proved the last straw for the Exeter-based airline, which operates almost 40% of UK domestic flights, as the government stalled on a controversial £100m loan. The UK Civil Aviation Authority announced early on Thursday morning that the airline had entered administration. It said all flights were cancelled and urged passengers not to go to airports. Flybe’s bankruptcy has come just a week before a budget that it hoped would help bolster its precarious finances, after the previous chancellor said he would look again at levels of air passenger duty (APD) .


However, the airline’s owners Connect Airways – a consortium of Virgin Atlantic, Stobart Air and hedge fund Cyrus Capital – have pulled the plug, a little over a year after buying it. The airline employed more than 2,000 people and was one of the leading carriers at airports including Belfast, Southampton, Manchester and Birmingham. Around 8 million people a year used its services. Unions have warned that other jobs would be put at risk by Flybe’s collapse, and transport links lost on dozens of domestic routes where it is the sole operator. Flybe has long struggled to balance the books, despite cost-cutting plans and redundancies, and was reporting losses of around £20m a year before the Connect takeover. [..] It is the second major British airline to go bankrupt in six months, following the collapse of Thomas Cook last September.

Read more …

Can we close the entire industry yet?

California-Based Cruise Ship Quarantined Off Pacific Coast (Pol.)

Another Princess Cruises ship has set off coronavirus alarms after a California passenger who traveled to Mexico died this week, more than 10 days after returning home without knowledge of his exposure. Two shiploads of passengers may have been exposed. State and federal officials are scurrying to contact 2,500-plus passengers who disembarked Feb. 21 from the San Francisco-Mexico cruise at the same time as the man who died, Gov. Gavin Newsom said Wednesday. California is also keeping Grand Princess passengers on the current San Francisco-Hawaii trip in the Pacific Ocean indefinitely until state and federal officials can assess how many passengers and crew have coronavirus or have been exposed.


“We have a number of passengers and crew members who have developed symptoms on this ship,” Newsom told reporters at a briefing this afternoon to announce a state of emergency. He later specified that 11 passengers and 10 crew members had symptoms, though he described the situation as fluid. Sixty-two passengers remain on the ship from the preceding San Francisco-Mexico journey, and they have been quarantined in their rooms, according to Princess Cruises. The Grand Princess was due back tonight in San Francisco until California requested that it remain at sea as the state sends test kits, Newsom said.

Read more …

A US Senator who doesn’t like capitalism at its finest. Commie!

Purell For $400? US Lawmaker Urges Amazon To Tamp Down Price Gouging (R.)

Amazon.com should stop third-party sellers from price gouging for items like Purell hand sanitizer as people seek to protect themselves from the coronavirus, U.S. Senator Edward Markey said in a letter to the online retailer on Wednesday. A box of small Purell bottles that usually sells for $10 was listed online for $400, he said. One third-party seller listed a bottle for $600 on Wednesday afternoon. However, the Amazon brand of hand sanitizer was listed for $8.25 for a large bottle. [..] “As the world confronts the prospect of a serious and far-reaching pandemic, corporate America has a responsibility to prevent profiteering on the sales of items such as hand-sanitizer and surgical masks,” Markey wrote in his letter.


Amazon called the price-gougers “bad actors.” “There is no place for price gouging on Amazon,” a spokesman said in a statement. “We continue to actively monitor our store and remove offers that violate our policies.” Amazon said it was monitoring prices to ensure sellers complied with fair pricing policies and said that it could remove sellers who violate them. Amazon last week barred more than 1 million products that inaccurately claimed to cure or defend against the coronavirus. Amazon also removed tens of thousands of deals from merchants that it said attempted to price gouge customers.

Read more …

Even Jonathan Turley doesn’t approve of this.

I like Biden claiming, in response to Bernie saying the establishment is circling the wagons for Biden, that literally everybody’s definition of the establishment is wrong: African Americans and single women in suburbia are the establishment. If you don’t boo that out of the room, who are you?

‘The establishment are all those hard-working, middle-class people, those African Americans, those single women in suburbia. They are the establishment,’ said Joe Biden.

Not as bad, though, as abusing his dead son Beau’s memory by saying Mayor Pete reminds him of Beau. Using your dead son for political games is real low.

But the real establishment are now stuck with Sleepy Joe, even though many will realize he’s roadkill.

The Greatest Victory Of The Establishment Since The Defeat Of The Huns (Turley)

The media and political establishment in Washington was openly celebrating what was portrayed as a near complete victory of Joe Biden over the hoards of Sanders supporters marching toward gates of the Beltway. The establishment united this week behind Biden with candidates like Pete Buttigieg, Amy Klobuchar, and others rallying forces to defeat Bernie Sanders at all costs. Not since the victory over Attila the Hun at the Battle of the Catalaunian Plains has the ancien regime experienced such a thrilling moment. However, the history is not good for those celebrating behind the walls of Rome.


I recently wrote how there remains a visceral distaste for the media and political establishment for many voters as they watched the concerted effort to defeat outsider candidates. That was also the case in 2016 with the effort to elect Hillary Clinton. The utter joy expressed this morning will only fuel that feeling of disenfranchisement. What we can expect is the continued strategic endorsements of establishment figures in the coming weeks and exhaustive coverage on the weakening Sanders and the surging Biden. MSNBC was particularly aggressive in framing the election night and attacking the very premise of the Sanders’ movement. MSNBC anchor Nicolle Wallace bizarrely claimed that there was no effort by the establishment to prop up Biden.

Wallace declared “Bernie Sanders… he has turned this idea of the establishment – he’s weaponized it against Biden,” she said. “The Democratic establishment did nothing for Joe Biden.” Really? Various establishment figures lined up behind Biden in the last week while CNN and MSNBC continued a relentless series of attacks on Sanders and his supporters. Nevertheless, host Rachel Maddow agreed that sought to downplay the concerted effort in DC to push Biden: “every headline in all political coverage all around the country is like, ‘The establishment is coalescing the establishment.” She then suggested that this is all a lie that was used against that other seemingly wrongly candidate, Hillary Clinton: “It’s what he did against Hillary Clinton in 2016 as well.”


Maddow simply dismisses the admissions of how the DNC rigged elements of the 2016 primary for Clinton or how Clinton took over the debt of the DNC to exercise such control. She also dismisses how polls showed that Clinton was widely viewed as unauthentic and the ultimate establishment figure when the public clearly wanted a change in Washington. Instead, Maddow and Wallace portray the entire movement by Sanders to be a lie. Not to be subtle, Wallace not only calls this all a lie but portrays Biden’s victory (with a long line of establishment endorsement) as a victory over the establishment: “But it’s a lie, I mean, it’s a lie. Listen, and I say this as a dispassionate former Republican who watched my party sort of implode around fake truths and false grievances, the establishment had nothing to do with Joe Biden’s victory. He’s flat broke, he has not a single ad on the air. He’s not advertising in any Super Tuesday states!”

Read more …

Not a great piece, but few people understand what’s going on.

Moscow’s Difficult Decision on Idlib (Lawrence)

The Syrian Arab Army, a force for good, must not stop short of decisive victory in Idlib, the governorate in northwest Syria sheltering the last jihadist militias operating on Syrian soil. Russia, which is correctly (and legally) supporting the S.A.A.’s campaign, should try to avoid a direct conflict with a NATO member but should engage Turkish forces if there is no alternative. NATO, breaking its own Article 5 covenant, will not come to the aid of a member nation engaged in so despicable an assault on another sovereign nation. I am not alone in holding this opinion. Don’t forget: Most NATO members are squeamish, mealy-mouthed Europeans who have given up the ghost in Syria. It will do the entire world much good if the egregious Erdogan sustains the bloodiest nose of his six years as Turkey’s dictatorial president in consequence of this drive into Syria.

Let us say precisely the same of what remains of the U.S. presence in Syria. Excellent it will be if Washington must at last acknowledge that it has lost every chip it has put down in Syria since it began arming, training and financing a variety of vicious Islamist factions, including the Islamic State, in early 2012 at the very latest. At this point it claims to be protecting Syrian oilfields from… Syria. This is not Turkey’s first foray into Syrian territory, let us remember. It launched a similar campaign in 2016; it began another incursion last autumn. Turkey has from the start of the Syrian conflict been a conduit for arms supplies to the Islamic State and other jihadists, while transshipping Syrian oil from ISIS–controlled refineries into international markets.

[..] Erdogan has betrayed the Russians so often it is a wonder Moscow has any patience left for him. A Turkish F–16 shot down a Russian jet two months after Russian aircraft deployed in Syria five years ago. Ankara and Moscow agreed two years ago to establish a ceasefire zone in northwest Syria, with Turkey also committing to remove jihadists led by Hayat Tahrir al–Sham, formerly al–Nusra, which was formerly al–Qaeda in Syria in the name-changing shell game these cutthroats play. That accord went the way of the West (so to say) long ago.

Read more …

How to make normal procedures sound scary. Yes, Russia may have send a few ships through the Bosporus, in case Erdogan would have closed it.

Wonder what will be made public about the talks today. Erdogan will declare victory no doubt. How far will Lavrov go to deny that?

Russia Reinforces Syria Before Putin-Erdogan Talks (R.)

Russia is racing to reinforce its troops in Syria by sea and air before talks between the Russian and Turkish leaders in Moscow on Thursday, flight data and shipping movements show. The two presidents, Vladimir Putin and Tayyip Erdogan, agreed to meet after a surge in tensions between their countries over fighting in Syria’s Idlib province between Russian-backed Syrian government forces and rebels allied to Turkey. The fighting has raised the prospect of a direct clash between their armies, which operate in close proximity on opposing sides, and Erdogan hopes the talks will yield a ceasefire in Idlib.


A Reuters analysis of flight data and correspondents’ monitoring of shipping in the Bosphorus Strait in northwestern Turkey show Russia began to step up naval and airborne deliveries to Syria on Feb. 28, the day after 34 Turkish soldiers were killed in an air strike in Syria. That incident prompted concern in Moscow that Turkey might close the Bosphorus to Russian warships and bar Russian military transport planes from using Turkish air space. The Russian Defence Ministry did not immediately respond to a request for comment. A Turkish official, who asked not to be identified, said there was no plan to close the strait, which would force Russia to take longer routes to Syria. But Russia appears to be reinforcing Syria at its fastest rate since October, when U.S. forces withdrew from some parts of Syria and Moscow scrambled to fill the vacuum.

Read more …

Stalemate.

Tens Of Thousands Blocked At Greek-Turkey Border (K.)

A total of 32,423 individuals were prevented from entering Greece as of Saturday morning and 231 have been arrested, Greek authorities said on Wednesday on the latest count of irregular migrants attempting to enter Greece at the Evros border region with Turkey. According to the data, from 6 a.m. on Wednesday to 6 p.m. the same day, 11 individuals were arrested in Evros, most of which have been identified as Afghani nationals. A total of 4,600 people were prevented from entering illegally in Greece during the same 12-hour period. On Wednesday, Greek authorities fired tear gas and stun grenades to thwart a crowd of migrants making a push to cross the border from Turkey, as tensions increased after Turkey declared it was allowing migrants and refugees to reach Europe.

Read more …

Hedge funds buying family homes for cheap. That is Europe.

Greece’s Economic ‘Recovery’ Good News For No One But The Rich (Varoufakis)

Costas runs a small bookshop in my central Athens neighbourhood. Although jovial by constitution, he finds it difficult to hide the worry lines multiplying on his face. Fifteen years ago he put his flat up as collateral for a business loan to spruce up the bookshop. When the Greek debt crisis wreaked its havoc, it was impossible to service that loan. Today, Costas is one of hundreds of thousands facing foreclosures by funds that have purchased debt like his from the banks at bargain basement prices. The bailiff and the auctioneer are circling above distressed homeowners and small business people such as Costas.

Paradox is a Greek word for good reason: today’s Greece proves that it is perfectly possible for the state and for the majority of citizens to be sinking deeper into insolvency while the oligarchy makes a mint from trading in their assets. But why would investors lend to the Greek government cheaply if it remains bankrupt?

The reason is that the troika of Greece’s creditors – the EU, European Central Bank and the IMF – have taken 85% of government debt out of the money markets and placed it squarely on the shoulders of Europe’s taxpayers. They also deferred all repayments until after 2032 and extended another €30bn of official loans to the Greek government to cover its repayments to privateers. So why not lend to the Greek government at a small, yet positive, interest rate when the alternative is to lend to the German or the Dutch governments at the current negative interest rates? As long as the Greek government remains the troika’s model prisoner, lending to Greece’s insolvent state at minuscule rates is lucrative. Paradox solved!

Turning to Greece’s private sector, how can investors profit from it if it too is bankrupt? With great ease is the answer, as Costas’s case illustrates. His loan of €100,000 was sold on by his bank to a hedge fund for €8,000. If the fund auctions off his flat for €20,000, its profit rate will hit an astonishing 250%. The fact that Costas will lose both his home and his bookshop, with detrimental effects on the state’s taxes and outlays (as he begins to draw unemployment benefit), does not even appear on the radar of the hedge fund or the international media.

Read more …

Maybe down a few percentage points from 2015, but not much. Entire families living on $400-$800 a month. And no, Greece is not cheap.

Half Of Greek Families Still Cite Pensions As Their Main Source Of Income (K.)

Pensions remain the main source of income for half of Greece’s households, a survey by the Small Enterprises Institute of the Hellenic Confederation of Professionals, Craftsmen & Merchants (IME GSEVEE) has shown. The phenomenon is linked to the particularly large number of pensioners – 2.55 million, according to official figures – and the fact that unemployment remains at high levels while salaries remain low. The survey shows that although the country has successfully concluded its third bailout, the decade-long financial crisis is still having a strong impact on Greek society. This is even more obvious in lower income brackets that continue to be at risk of serious social and economic uncertainties.


The survey was held from late December to early January, that is before the coronavirus outbreak and whatever economic impact it has had so far. The IME GSEVEE survey, conducted in association with Marc researchers, showed that 49.4 percent of households declared pensions as their main source of income, up from 49.1 percent a year earlier.

Read more …

 

 

 

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Home Forums Debt Rattle March 5 2020

This topic contains 40 replies, has 17 voices, and was last updated by  Dr. D 7 months, 4 weeks ago.

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 41 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #54812

    DPC Mott Street, Chinatown, New York c1900   • Wuhan Coronavirus Infections Spike (R.) • Chinese Scientists Identify Two Strains Of The Coronavir
    [See the full post at: Debt Rattle March 5 2020]

    #54813

    V. Arnold
    Participant

    DPC Mott Street, Chinatown, New York c1900

    Such an excellent photo…

    No matter what you read, what you hear, what you’re told; pay attention to your here and now; that is what to believe as fact! The rest is just theatre…drama…maya…

    #54814

    boscohorowitz
    Participant

    There has to be a word in some language for the cognitive discomfort one feels, the strange surreality, when the absurd but logical things one expects to happen actually do.

    #54816

    Dr. D
    Participant

    Okay, let’s go the other way. CDC claims Covid has 3% death rate. Wuhan has 20M metro, roughly, and we know has not been contained. Well 20M x 3% = 600,000 dead. Somebody want to show me these people? I will TOTALLY believe you; that fits the response. But 3,000 dead = 0.015%

    Can we stop lying now? It’s one way or the other: either people died, or they didn’t. Either it’s 3% or it isn’t. But your math makes no sense. Stop.

    11 are dead in America. So you’re saying with no borders, no quarantine, no stop of flying since 1 Jan, there are only 300 people infected among 330M people in 60 days? Stop. You’re hurting my thought-thinker.

    There are 138 identified. That means with no testing nationwide, no tracking of people, no knocking on doors, we claim to know HALF of all people infected, and half of those were on the Diamond Princess. Stop.

    Maybe we don’t know: certainly the critics think so. In that case, if there were ONE person on Jan 1st, with an R3 (Fibonacci) doubling every 2 days as claimed = 5,702,887 infected and 171,000 U.S. deaths. More because that guy came on a plane carrying 100 passengers. (~50% rate = 267,000,000 infected @ 8,010,00 deaths)

    Unless all the whining and screaming stopped it. I swear to God we’re all going to die from hating facts and being bad at math. It’s like herding buffalo over a cliff: so easy a cave man could do it.

    Which do you want to give up: the R-naught, the number infected, or the 3% death rate? They can’t all be true. Corollary: if they’re not true, it’s not a pandemic.

    “Ask yourself what would happen if the headlines were all exclaiming COVID’s 98% survival rate.” Indeed.

    Today:
    “We know, irrefutably, one thing about the coronavirus in the United States: The number of cases reported in every chart and table is far too low.”

    Yes, but of course the conclusion they draw from the lack of evidence is “Panic!”, when it’s equally rational to draw the conclusion “Don’t Panic.” Of course! If it bleeds, it leads, even if I have to pour the ketchup.

    Ask yourself what would happen if the headlines were all exclaiming COVID’s 98% survival rate.”

    They cut a roadblock in testing and let the States do it. Reversing centralization and Soviet bureaucracy, and also control. By Rod Rosenstein’s sister. Hopefully this gets somewhere. It’s probably good because all the right people are complaining about the new rule that will free up the test kits. That leaves the problem of the test kits being lousy worldwide, constantly throwing bad results, a feature of the 3-part engineered biovirus.

    “Purell for $400? US Lawmaker Urges Amazon to Tamp Down Price Gouging (R.)”

    Price controls. Because that’s always worked before! Every time it’s tried! Oh wait, I meant the #Opposite. Now you can have Purell at $1, except the shelves will be empty for the next 100 years and Jimmy has a black market out back where it’s $600, not $400. He pays kickbacks to the police, the party and Senator Markey, (That’s the extra $200) so don’t think of reporting them. Like Epstein, you might not kill yourself.

    The Greatest Victory of the Establishment Since the Defeat of the Huns (Turley)”

    Wow, if Karl Rove, John Bolton, and James Comey are on your side, it’s truly the army of the angels. You should be so proud. And the problem here isn’t that they can’t screw Bernie: as commenters here said, they surely would somehow. The problem is, “What Next?” They are going to live down their devout, knee-bowing wish to prefer Trump to a Progressive. ANY Progressive. Ever. Any person in all America that would ever deign to raise wages and help any working man. I don’t think that’s a winner, and it will be less a winner 5 years from now. But if they resist reform, this is what happens. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrrhic_victory

    “Moscow’s Difficult Decision on Idlib (Lawrence)”

    Russia has been working with Turkey a long time. They know what they’re doing. Still annoying though. And long.

    #54817

    neoh
    Participant

    I think I agree V.Arnold.
    What I perceive as facts, at least so far, is that there is a really nasty “bug” circulating that seems to be more fatal to the sick and elderly (fwiw, I’m elderly). Worse than the flu but know where near anything that would make a popular disaster movie.
    The reaction of people is a different matter. Weekend warrior Libertarians, Anarchists, and Socialists are convinced the sky is falling and want the government to fix it. No thanks. And I don’t want to volunteer for mass testing either. I prefer to delay starting that precedent at this time. Once that happens, sheeple will willingly go to government quarantine camps.
    Good chance this will happen. MSM and alt media have linked arms and decided the governments should be allowed to do anything to control a viral bug that is no where near disaster. Once precedent is established it then becomes difficult to reverse.

    #54818

    Just in: cases in Netherlands went from 38 yesterday to 82 today. Starting to feel like Italy.

    #54820

    zerosum
    Participant

    Faith
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faith

    What matters is what I do which is based upon what I believe.
    What I believe is based upon the conclusions derived from my perceptions. (what I see, hear, read, and feel.)
    Once I have arrived at a conclusion. Changing what I believe is almost impossible.
    The facts don’t matter. The math. doesn’t matter. What you believe doesn’t matter.
    Its called faith.
    There are many faiths.

    Discussions are postponed due to an emergency. Now, is the time to go and eat.

    #54821

    hugho
    Participant

    Ilargi, the story that the UK only has 15 beds for serious respiratory patients which first surfaced with Chris Martenson is misleading. Those are extracorporeal membrane oxygen beds which are also used for other deadly infections . There happen to be very few in this country as well. For corona virus, normal ICU/ventilator beds are just fine for 99% of cases. But not nearly enough of those either if the US really gets hit.

    #54822

    John Day
    Participant

    I realized last night, just after I hit “enter” that my speaking of needing something like a food kiosk out in the parking lot, with surfaces that could be easily and repeatedly cleaned, was not specific.
    I meant that we need to use a hot-dog stand with easily disinfected surfaces for screening people who wait in their cars after calling in, then go back to their cars and return home after screening.
    It can’t share the ventilation system of the main clinic. It really should better be completely open to the air.
    It will seem odd, but this is Austin, and we are done with freezes for the year, until next winter.
    It is now a big question if various regions have one or both strains, L & S in circulation. It is a further stratification of risk, which supports ongoing heroic attempts to limit spread, identify cases, isolate and treat.

    #54823

    zerosum
    Participant

    Senators Admit US Virus Test Rollout Goals Won’t Be Met: “It’s Way Smaller Than A Million”

    Why should you believe him? We have been saying the same thing before he woke up.
    What is the cost or profit in making a test kit available and in testing a person for the con virus.?
    That is an important question in the USA
    The profit question is more important than the 3% that will die and not pay their invoice.

    #54824

    Dr. D
    Participant

    If the test says they “have” it, does anything else happen? Or do they go home with a taco and a box of kleenex, unbothered?

    #54825

    neoh
    Participant

    I agree Dr, D, If someone is dumb enough to buy Purell then let them buy it. The best way to stop hoarding is to let the market set the price. Especially in this case when there is plenty of Purell available but the shelves are empty due to frightened sheeple. There is a difference between the Purell example and price gouging by pharma, where the cost to provide is low but if you want to live then you’ll figure out how to pay the cost. But the sheeple believed George W when he said that Americans should pay more because of the R&D involved. Never mind that the same drug by the same supplier is only 5% of the cost elsewhere.
    I guess I shouldn’t be surprised though. Let’s see Korea/. Viet Nam (domino theory) etc etc etc. Too many to mention.
    Had to buy dust masks for my company yesterday from the same industrial supplier I’ve been doing business with for 30 + years. All I can say is that the sheeple have panicked. All medias are having a field day!

    #54826

    Doc Robinson
    Participant

    Re: ICU beds in the UK (the USA has perhaps 10 times as many per capita)

    UK population is 66 million.
    Lets say only 30% of the population, or 20 million, get infected with the COVID-19 virus.
    If 15% of those infected need hospital admission, that’s 3 million.
    If 20% of those hospital admissions need ICU care, that makes 600,000 patient needing the ICU (as the pandemic runs its course).

    The UK has less than 5,000 ICU beds.

    So let’s look at some statistics: it is likely that more than 30% of the whole UK population will get Covid-19 – it may be as high as 60% in some estimates. Most will have no or mild illness but maybe one in seven will need hospital admission. Of patients in hospital up to one in five may need ICU care – that would be an unprecedented number of people admitted to ICU. As many as one in 50 of patients known to have Covid-19 may die from it.

    In 2012 the UK had about 4,100 critical care beds including ICU beds and “high dependency” beds which are a step down from full ICU care… Germany has approximately four times as many ICU beds per capita as the UK and the USA perhaps 10-fold as many. Data from 2017 suggest little change.

    Most UK ICUs therefore run at or above 90% occupancy and often can only admit new patients only by discharging others – even when workload is normal. Covid-19 will increase pressures not only because of weight of numbers but because intermediate treatments for pneumonia and lung failure are “aerosol-generating” (ie they risk spreading the disease) so cannot be used and early recourse to ICU is required.

    I’m an ICU doctor. The NHS isn’t ready for the coronavirus crisis
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/03/icu-doctor-nhs-coronavirus-pandemic-hospitals

    #54827

    zerosum
    Participant

    Some examples – faith/opinion
    Blain: Cutting Rates Is Now “About As Relevant As Painting A Sinking Ship”

    Peter Schiff: They’re Gonna Need A Bigger Rate Cut!

    China Hints At Blackmail Over Pharmaceutical Exports, Would “Plunge US Into Mighty Sea Of Coronavirus”

    IMF: Virus outbreak will slow global economic growth this year
    (Its the con virus)

    UK airline Flybe goes into bankruptcy as virus hurts demand
    (Its the con virus)

    #54828

    John Day
    Participant

    http://www.johndayblog.com/2020/03/l-straincoronavirus.html
    The new coronavirus information yesterday was that there are 2 strains, with different fatality rates. The original “S” strain continues to spread through China, where the data was collected, and causes fewer fatalities. It is less aggressive of a pathogen. The newer “L” strain exploded in Wuhan, and appears to have been responsible for most of the deaths there.
    Of course we still don’t know the real numbers, but most estimates are vastly higher than official numbers, and based on cremation rates.
    These 2 strains are significantly different, and the rapidity of the arising of the very differently mutated L strain suggest that it entered the ongoing epidemic in Wuhan, and transformed it into a horror-show. The Chinese authorities may have been acting upon the milder illness of the first S strain wave for their early decisions, leading into Chinese New Year.
    Of course I wonder what strains are circulating where in our world, but I also really wonder where that deadly L coronavirus strain came from.
    The question of how this lab virus got into human circulation is still unsettled in public discourse. I do not believe pangolins got it from bats. This new information again brings up the question of “accident” or “attack” and it is now a 2-pronged question.
    Whether the initial novel coronavirus S type was accidental or offensive, I really must favor the second L type coronavirus being an offensive attack.
    The killer wave came at a particularly vulnerable moment, with China having set the defensive response way too low. The aggressor could be assured of deeper penetration and more damage, once the defense was set as mainly-propaganda.
    How may China respond? To whom might China respond in kind?
    (The article below carries on with the approved narrative that these strains are naturally occurring, but points out that “neutral site” mutations diverge by 17%, a vast divergence in regions of the genome, which are not subject to evolutionary selection pressure as viruses multiply and spread. This effectively excludes a natural series of mutations as the cause.)

    Population genetic analyses of 103 SARS-CoV-2 genomes indicated that these viruses evolved into two major types (designated L and S), that are well defined by two different SNPs that show nearly complete linkage across the viral strains sequenced to date. Although the L type (∼70%) is more prevalent than the S type (∼30%), the S type was found to be the ancestral version. Whereas the L type was more prevalent in the early stages of the outbreak in Wuhan, the frequency of the L type decreased after early January 2020. Human intervention may have placed more severe selective pressure on the L type, which might be more aggressive and spread more quickly.
    https://academic.oup.com/nsr/advance-article/doi/10.1093/nsr/nwaa036/5775463#authorNotesSectionTitle

    US immediately breaks ceasefire it just signed with Afghan Taliban
    https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/03/us-breaks-its-just-signed-agreement-with-the-taliban.html#more

    Elizabeth Warren will drop out today.
    (Liz Warren should endorse the “other woman of color”, Tulsi Gabbard. Her revenge would be sweet and broad.)
    ​ ​The news has been confirmed by NBC. Warren only had 50 delegates, and it’s likely many will side with Bernie Sanders, who has long since won the battle to be the progressive standard-bearer.
    ​ ​The big question now is: To whom will Warren give her endorsement? Will she swallow her pride, put the acrimony behind her and side with Bernie Sanders, whom she repeatedly touted as an ideological ally against the party ‘establishment’? Or will Warren side with Biden, a move that would undoubtedly infuriate millions of progressives who will presumably follow Bernie leftward?
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/elizabeth-warren-drops-out-democratic-primary-nyt

    ​Fistfights erupt in Turkish parliament closed session over Erdogn’s adventurism killing Turkish soldiers in a vain cause.
    ​https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/watch-massive-brawl-turkish-parliament-after-erdogan-blamed-troop-deaths

    US immediately breaks ceasefire it just signed with Afghan Taliban
    https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/03/us-breaks-its-just-signed-agreement-with-the-taliban.html#more

    Elizabeth Warren will drop out today.
    (Liz Warren should endorse the “other woman of color”, Tulsi Gabbard. Her revenge would be sweet and broad.)
    ​ ​The news has been confirmed by NBC. Warren only had 50 delegates, and it’s likely many will side with Bernie Sanders, who has long since won the battle to be the progressive standard-bearer.
    ​ ​The big question now is: To whom will Warren give her endorsement? Will she swallow her pride, put the acrimony behind her and side with Bernie Sanders, whom she repeatedly touted as an ideological ally against the party ‘establishment’? Or will Warren side with Biden, a move that would undoubtedly infuriate millions of progressives who will presumably follow Bernie leftward?
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/elizabeth-warren-drops-out-democratic-primary-nyt

    #54829

    John Day
    Participant

    Oops, it over-posted, sorry…

    #54830

    PlanetaryCitizen
    Participant

    Dr D, so are you claiming that all 20 million people in Wuhan are infected by the virus? Clearly you must be to come up with your figures. There’s contained, and there’s containment procedures. In your version people must be running around kissing one another on the mouth willy nilly.

    #54831

    Dr D Rich
    Participant

    So Dr. D, what you’re saying is the statistics for this “new disease” do not correspond to the hyperbole and hysteria. Btw, what follows in no way detractsfm from the fact that each individual’s major illness or death is a catastrophe.
    The con man or alternately the betting man says “let’s just wait and see what happens”.
    Here’s a genuine example of how probability and statistics establish the “rigged” game in medicine, but from the other direction.

    Patient X arrived in specialty clinic with undiagnosed condition of which most humans are familiar that occurs 50 out of 100,000 times in the adult population. The expression of this not-so-uncommon condition in the specialists bodily area of expertise occurs in 2% of cases. The expression of this condition signifies a survival for the patient of 7.9 weeks, yes, as in 1.9 months.
    While counseling the aforementioned patient about the diagnosis, implications and prognosis, a second patient awaits counseling for another previously undiagnosed condition that has already resulted in irreparable sensory loss in the affected organ. This condition occurs in 1 out of 5,000 people.

    So far, what are the chances these two patients, indeed these two unrelated events happened consecutively? Well, it’s crudely the product of the individual chances Or:

    50/100,000 x 2/100 x 1/5,000 = 100/50 billion
    Or
    1 out of 500 million (rarer than winning a qPowerball lottery)

    But the story doesn’t end there. While counseling those first two patients, a very junior hospital administrator interrupts the specialist and informs her that her immediate attention is required elsewhere in the medical center to address a sensory threatening postoperative complication in a patient operated on by two other surgeon’s, a complication that occurs about 1 in 10,000 cases.

    Other than astronomical, what is the chance these 3 unrelated events landed on the same specialists lap at the same time/consecutively? A product of the chances, Or:

    1/500,000,000 x 1/10,000 = 1/5,000,000,000,000

    One out of 5 trillion

    That’s the definition of a rigged game.

    In a master stroke of logic in this scenario, the employer retained the pulmonologist who failed to order a chest CT, the neurologist who never ordered an MRI of the brain, the surgeons who failed to respond to their patient’s postop emergency, and family practitioner chief of the medical staff who failed to fill the call schedule.

    How do you think the leaders of a medical system capable of that recklessness are going to handle a bonafide crisis? They’re going to use marketing slogans, propaganda and political posturing to bamboozle their patients, patrons and general public.

    #54832

    I just need to get this in and then I’ll go back up and read the bits:
    Everclear comes in 75.5% and 95% grades of pure ethanol. I carry a tiny spray bottle of it with me in the wintertime- I just spritz the potentially offending surface or my hands (I hate the goo in the purell-type stuff). It takes a bit of time for to evaporate, and the spritzer I use produces an extremely fine mist.
    When I get colds, I get ’em bad. They so often “go away” and then drop into my lungs a week later.
    Do corticosteroids play any role in the treatment of these viruses?

    #54833

    Dr. D
    Participant

    The 10 elements of an unstoppable engineered biovirus are named here:
    https://www.oftwominds.com/blogfeb20/unstoppable2-20.html

    This means the possibility of quarantine is near zero, and certainly when lacking measures like building a fence and shooting any thousands who venture into no-mans land, while catapulting in supplies. That sounds bizarre, except that’s what they did during the Plague, an actual disease with an actual death rate.

    So do the people in Wuhan have it? Um, unless they were surrounded by angels flapping their wings, then yes. Give me any plausible scenario where anyone could NOT have it. Remember it has a 40-day incubation, a re-infection rate, lives in dogs and cats, and 9 days on surfaces and climbs the damp pipes through buildings.

    I’m sure quite a number of people who sheltered DON’T have it. But they are starving. As soon as they leave their apartment, they WILL have it. So will the men delivering the food. And soon I’ll have it, too if I don’t already. So thank God it’s only a bad flu.

    Again, I am missing something here, but even more that we’ve proven there are two viruses, China has admitted COVID is from the lab, the virus chimera has three Crispr pieces including HIV and SARS, it seems only logical that they released a VERY bad virus that killed 600k-1,000k and the only cure was a) it’s extremely racial (unlikely) or b) they IMMEDIATELY released a downgraded but still quite dangerous version right on top of it to stamp it out. And thank goodness, considering. Because of structure, this downgrade is still quite racial via ACE2 receptors, but nowhere near the mortality of the actual weapon they were so proud of when they crowed in open papers on it.

    Next bet: what makes you think we didn’t know this, and the Dark State released it? Although they must have rock-solid, definitely convinced China it was China’s own fault or they’d have nuked us back already, that doesn’t mean it’s TRUE, just that they believed it. The timing is very, VERY suspicious, and not for China, but for a Deep State who’s always said (essentially) that they would do this, and has been smoking red-hot for implementing all the very specific social and infrastructure features that would protect the elite in case of a biovirus. Stay tuned.

    In any case, I imagine from the reaction that yes, from above, yes from the 10 engineered features, everyone in charge knows it cannot BE stopped. But we CAN stop millions from dying in panic, shortages, market crashes, and resulting war. So we’re doing that. It’s also only as bad as a bad year in influenza, which is 650k/yr EVERY YEAR, and +1M in a bad year. Yawn, no one cares because the flu is REAL and not on Facebook and Twitter. In #AntiReality, we only care what’s on T.V., not when your house is falling down or your daughter’s in danger from the guy next door. Who’s the principal/police chief. That’s not exciting: who cares about that? We only care when O’Brien TELLS us to care. So we’re going to have a +1M death rate, easy. Aaaaaand just like we do every year when no one cared.

    Just like the 30,000 opioid deaths we had and no one cared.
    Just like the 10,000 war deaths we had and no one cared.
    Just like the 645,000 heart disease deaths we had and no one cared.
    Just like the 1,250,000 traffic deaths we have and no one cared.
    Just like the 828,000 suicide deaths we have and no one cared.
    Just like the 61,000 legal prescription drug deaths and no one cared.
    Just like the 251,000 malpractice deaths we had and no one cared.

    We have 11 deaths. Newsflash: I don’t care.

    Clearly I am 3,075,000 times more likely to die from the causes above. So are you.

    I’d worry about your pension being stolen and your house repossessed. Or even administrative reform in Dr. D’s ward. Those will actually kill you. Covid won’t. Unless you can show me some numbers.

    #54834

    zerosum
    Participant

    “Unless you can show me some numbers.”
    No tests means no numbers.
    I hope that we are not too close to the spitting distances

    The con virus
    There are 3 virus. The L and S virus have been identified in the lab.
    The Con virus has been identified by the bloggers.
    It the oil for the printing press. It hides all errors and scams produced by the elites.

    Update (1450ET): VP Mike Pence said Thursday that the Coast Guard had delivered coronavirus tests to the ‘Grand Princess’ cruise ship off the coast of San Francisco. Pence also admitted during an update from the White House task force that the CDC doesn’t have enough tests to meet anticipated demand going forward, while HHS Secretary Azar said earlier that 75,000 test kits would be shipped by the end of the week.

    This is really not helping the administration deflect criticisms that it failed to adequately prepare for the virus.

    Meanwhile, Washington’s King County, part of suburban Seattle, has just reported another 20 cases of Covid-19, increasing the state of Washington’s total by roughly 20%.
    —–

    #54836

    Dr D Rich
    Participant

    Dr. D
    We can blame Alain Enthoven for this predicament and his personal war on physician/MD autonomous authority. It took 50+ years, but we’ve been reduced to technicians, opportunists capitalizing off the sick, frail and wounded.

    #54837

    oxymoron
    Participant

    It has the strange effect economically of kind of giving the population a little shake that says ‘hey the govt’ won’t really look after you. The media lie to you. The banks and corporations are out to get you. You have to start to look after yourselves’
    That’s what this tiny little virus mixed in the age of too much fake news and weirdness is telling us.
    In Australia the reaction has been to clean out all the supermarkets of toilet paper – which is Freud for “I am now shitting myself”
    I just look forward to the seed section being cleaned out. Then we are headed in the right direction.
    Dr D. You are onto it – it is a thing but it is a heist. Even if it is not a bullshit story there are just so many bullshit stories that you have to just put it in there with the rest by default.

    #54838

    Dr D: Jon Rappoport (Nomorefakenews) has been down on flu statistics for a long time. Ed Curtain has a post that points out that the CDC admits to 3,482 flu deaths [as of the post, which is March 2].
    We get sick. Sometimes we get really, really sick. Most of the time we never know what hit us.
    By the way, I have seen death by cancer much too often now to care about heart disease at my late stage of life. Give me a heart attack any day.

    #54839

    boscohorowitz
    Participant

    “That sounds bizarre, except that’s what they did during the Plague, an actual disease with an actual death rate.”

    As a writer, I of course admire Dr D’s literary style. Even out of context, the above pleases me silly.

    #54840

    Dave Note
    Participant

    We’re just getting started on reverse engineering the origin of Covid19 using genetic forensics coupled with know mutation rates of many viruses that have been cataloged.

    Any virus mutates as it goes through host populations. They tend to get selected to be less virulent because they will run out of ‘host’ if they kill everything in sight.

    Who ever let this baby out, it’s origin will be found.

    From Taiwanese TV

    (Note: haplotypes are used to differentiate mutations from a common source, they provide a timeline pointing back to a source, they are not different viruses, just flavors of a single one if you will)

    “The man in the video is a top virologist and pharmacologist (Taiwan) who performed a long and detailed search for the source of the virus. He spends the first part of the video explaining the various haplotypes (varieties, if you will), and explains how they are related to each other, how one must have come before another, and how one type derived from another. He explains this is merely elementary science and nothing to do with geopolitical issues, describing how, just as with numbers in order, 3 must always follow 2.

    One of his main points is that the type infecting Taiwan exists only in Australia and the US and, since Taiwan was not infected by Australians, the infection in Taiwan could have come only from the US.

    The basic logic is that the geographical location with the greatest diversity of virus strains must be the original source because a single strain cannot emerge from nothing. He demonstrated that only the US has all the five known strains of the virus (while Wuhan and most of China have only one, as do Taiwan and South Korea, Thailand and Vietnam, Singapore, and England, Belgium and Germany), constituting a thesis that the haplotypes in other nations may have originated in the US.

    Korea and Taiwan have a different haplotype of the virus than China, perhaps more infective but much less deadly, which would account for a death rate only 1/3 that of China.

    Neither Iran nor Italy were included in the above tests, but both countries have now deciphered the locally prevalent genome and have declared them of different varieties from those in China, which means they did not originate in China but were of necessity introduced from another source. It is worth noting that the variety in Italy has approximately the same fatality rate as that of China, three times as great as other nations, while the haplotype in Iran appears to be the deadliest with a fatality rate of between 10% and 25%. (7) (8) (9)

    Due to the enormous amount of Western media coverage focused on China, much of the world believes the coronavirus spread to all other nations from China, but this now appears to have been proven wrong. With about 50 nations scattered throughout the world having identified at least one case at the time of writing, it would be very interesting to examine virus samples from each of those nations to determine their location of origin and the worldwide sources and patterns of spread….”

    #54841

    Dave Note
    Participant

    Japanese virologists have agreed and concluded the same as their colleagues in Taiwan

    #54842

    Dave Note
    Participant

    Continuing from the Taiwanese Tv show:

    “The Virologist further stated that the US has recently had more than 200 “pulmonary fibrosis” cases that resulted in death due to patients’ inability to breathe, but whose conditions and symptoms could not be explained by pulmonary fibrosis. He said he wrote articles informing the US health authorities to consider seriously those deaths as resulting from the coronavirus, but they responded by blaming the deaths on e-cigarettes, then silenced further discussion. …

    The Taiwanese doctor then stated the virus outbreak began earlier than assumed, saying, “We must look to September of 2019”.

    He stated the case in September of 2019 where some Japanese traveled to Hawaii and returned home infected, people who had never been to China.

    This was two months prior to the infections in China and just after the CDC suddenly and totally shut down the Fort Detrick bio-weapons lab claiming the facilities were insufficient to prevent loss of pathogens. (10) (11)

    He said he personally investigated those cases very carefully (as did the Japanese virologists who came to the same conclusion).. This might indicate the coronavirus had already spread in the US but where the symptoms were being officially attributed to other diseases, and thus possibly masked.”

    This makes me wonder whether a variety of Covid19 is already widely distributed in the US since Sept 2019.

    The US still has no test kits widely available NOW at the local level, and certainly not back then in Sept 2019.

    News Flash:
    “South Korea has just managed to test more than 140,000 people for the coronavirus, using kits with sensitivity rates of over 95 per cent from kits made from local factories”

    The US to date has tested a couple thousand, well played!

    The US response is a clown show.

    The logic seems to say, “If we don’t test we don’t have it!”

    Kinda like the dumb blond who told the bank manager after being called about an overdraft,” I can’t be out of money, I still have checks!”

    China’s Coronavirus: A Shocking Update. Did The Virus Originate in the US?

    #54843

    V. Arnold
    Participant

    For what reason would the Chinese engineer a virus which attacks Asian people, particularly?
    Makes zero sense to this one…
    …the majorities grasp of reality is questionable at best…

    #54844

    V. Arnold
    Participant

    Make that majority’s… ;-(

    #54845

    Dave Note
    Participant
    #54846

    VietnamVet
    Participant

    Yesterday was the second anniversary of the Salisbury England poisonings. One fatality and two gone missing. One, Yulia Skripal, a Russian citizen. But no judicial hearings. The COVID-19 outbreak is just as weird.

    China for the first month hid the outbreak and then suddenly quarantined Wuhan and extended the Lunar Holiday completely shutting down its industries and transport. Singapore and South Korea also enforced similar draconian measures. No government does this unless facing an existential threat. Italy, a developed country, is unlikely to inflate its 3.5% death rate. If anything it is higher.

    The American government is insanely lackadaisical. From the start its response has been a series of horrific SNAFUs. Due to failed tests and no surveillance, the USA has absolutely no idea of the location and extent of the epidemic in the USA. Donald Trump said today people infected with the novel coronavirus will get better “by sitting around and even going to work.”

    All reports indicate from infected areas indicate that 15% to 20% of the ill will need hospital care. The virus is so contagious it is estimated 50% or more Americans will be infected. That is 22 million Americans. Three coronavirus cases were just confirmed in my State. This will crash the healthcare system. Not to mention the death of millions of old farts like me. Likely before the November election.

    What does Donald Trump know that I don’t?

    Either we are victims of a evil conspiracy to eliminate the unproductive and there is an existing vaccine for the connected or the rot is so deep from wealth extraction that society is collapsing upon itself which the Establishment cannot acknowledge.

    #54847

    zerosum
    Participant

    I don’t know what kind of hat that I should wear.
    Just what TAE, and comments have, would make more than 3 s-f books.
    Is there a “Tom Clancy” hidding here?

    #54848

    Boogaloo
    Participant

    Now here is a new theory from a virologist who has close connections to Korea. He believes that the virus may have a symbiotic relationship with (otherwise) harmless bacteria in the environment. He notes that in some ways the spread of the virus is similar to bacterial diseases. If this is true, the virus can infect the bacteria and “hide” in the bacteria — before it reemerges. Fascinating theory.

    https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/nation/2020/03/119_285655.html

    #54849

    V. Arnold
    Participant

    Again, stepping back; the cv-19 is a virus; apart from that; nobody knows squat.
    The virus is not understood; transmission is not understood, how the virus works is not understood; its origins are not known; the fatality rate is not known; who is and is not vulnerable, is not understood; and on and on and on…
    All the chatter is nothing more than fear; humans cannot stand those things it does not understand; and especially if those unknowns can kill them…
    Fear is a thief; don’t let it steal from you…

    #54850

    WES
    Participant

    Dave Note:. Thanks for putting forth the info on tracing the origins of the coronavirus.

    There does seem to be a battle royal going on about where the virus started!

    #54851

    WES
    Participant

    Dr. D.:. Up here in Canada all they are doing is testing, then sending everyone home to self quarantine.

    Nobody is being admitted to the hospitals.

    What I do find very strange is the lack of test kits.

    #54852

    WES
    Participant

    V Arnold:. If you ignore what governments say, and just watch what they do, you can develop your own answer as to whether this coronavirus is serious or not.

    #54853

    WES
    Participant

    Dr. D. :. Another thing health officials are doing up here in Canada, is after someone tests positive, and is sent home to self quarantine, is they are contacting possible contacts and asking these people to self monitor, and if they get sick to self quarantine.

    Again very little testing is being done. Obviously hiding the lack of test kits.

    #54854

    WES
    Participant

    Raul:. Very nice picture showing horse polution! You know the stuff before cars!

    The kind of polution that smelled, attacted flies and other insects! Very nice to step into too!

    Yes, I remember my Father talking about how wonderful those days were! Not!

    As a kid, they used to take a new carefully unwrapped soap wrapper, remove the soap, and then insert horse dung into said soap wrapper, rewrap, and then leave it at someone’s door for discovery!

    Yes the good old days!

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