Reverse Engineer
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el gallinazo post=1484 wrote: As to the break down of the Stasi state through complexity and energy resources, as you know, I am rather sure that they are not facing an energy shortage in the least. Even if you accept the peak fossil fuel paradigm, they are decades away. (I am not writing that we are not running out of cheap fossil fuels, but rather that TPTSB have developed other sources of energy. But I don’t wish to get into that here and now, other than that they are having quite a bit of trouble with their whack-a-mole strategy of suppressing it from “leaking” out.) And complexity breakdown is usually a function of energy shortage.
Not that I don’t think that there will be a huge breakdown of international trade in the near future, precipitated by financial as opposed to energy reasons. But this will simply impoverish us farm animals, and not cripple the coercive state. That is what the presidential executive order of this weekend is all about
I know you have this opinion, however as of yet I haven’t read anything of yours to justify it. I’m sure you’ll present it in due time, but you’ll have to make a pretty good case to convince me of any more than a marginal probability.
As to the extent of your nihilism, I put it in the same category as other folks I’ve read who figure we are all boiling frogs and the Stazi State is inevitaly going to turn whatever is left of the population into Eloi Slaves of Morlock Masters. I don’t buy the meme.
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el gallinazo post=1480 wrote: Their ducks are now lined up in a row. We are frogs in the pot with the flame under it. What can we do about it? Aye, there’s the rub.
Be Patient, find a good Hole, and wait for the Failure of the Conduits. Fail they will EG, the complexity level and energy requirements for this model are hopelessly mismatched. When they fail, somemighty big changes will come your way. You can either be a force for Good, or you can be a Hopeless Nihilist. Your Choice.
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bluebird post=1475 wrote: Reverse Engineer said “EVERYBODY knows they are being ripped off by the TBTF banks.”
Not really. I have a sister who retired early from a major bank in Boston. She is fully entrenched that big banking is good, and she is glad that the government bailed out the TBTF banks because it is keeping the economy from getting worse. She is clueless about things going on around the world, that stuff is over there. She has told me that our government is taking care of us, we have rules and regulations that will prevent another 1930’s depression, that advances in technology are always coming to make our lives better, etc., etc.
She is worth a few million and has a professional financial planner to manage her portfolio. She truly believes that no one is stealing her wealth. If the markets go down, she has plenty of time to recoup the losses, because she told me, if you get out, you will miss the gains when the markets recover.
It is impossible to talk to her otherwise…I’m just a reader of blogs so what do I know.
OK, granted, there are plenty of clueless imbeciles out there. However, just based on Polls and so forth MOST people would like to see the bailouts stop and most of their Politicians given a one way ticket Outta Town, if not to the Great Beyond.
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Ilargi wrote: There is no easier time and way to gut a society’s wealth then when you manage to make that society believe it’s actually getting wealthier. People believe that version of the truth which makes them feel better.
Few people I know, even IRL, believe we are getting “wealthier”. Just about everyone I know beleives we are being scammed and taken to the cleaners by the TBTF Banks.
The problem is not that people don’t KNOW they are getting screwed, by now just about everyone does. The problem is that there isn’t anything short of REVOLUTION that can do anything about it. The political system is entirely captured; it doesn’t matter at all who you vote for. Demonstrations out in the street don’t matter, they are just ignored/supressed. The endless prose of Blogger Pundits doesn’t matter, they are all OUTSIDE the power structure looking IN through the Bullet Proof Glass Windows.
J6P simply isn’t hungry enough here in the FSofA for Revolution, its not that he is being fooled anymore. EVERYBODY knows they are being ripped off by the TBTF banks. There just isn’t anything you can do to stop it unless you topple Da Goobermint completely, and that is a rather intimidating project for most people to consider.
John Day post=1455 wrote:
Reverse Engineer
You might reconsider your analysis of thousands of years of global banking cartels in this light. What about the Rockefellers?After the reformation along with the consolidation of the royal families, several other banking houses were chartered by Protestants of various sorts, and the Holy Roman Catholic Church has always run its own Bank as well. In most cases you will find interlocking directorates with older Jewish Banking Houses for these banks, which here in the FSofA include the Bank of NY Mellon, JP Morgan-Chase (Morgan and Rockefeller interests). You’ll find connections in both banks to Warburg and Kuhn as well as the House of Rothschild.
By no means is the International Banking Syndicate a strictly Jewish operation anymore, however the first folks in on the Ponzi most definitely were Jewish.
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Sunshine post=1450 wrote:
Are they really so unique?What is unique is the connections inside the International Banking Syndicate that in modern times goes back to the Medici era, and predates that into ancient times going back into Rome and Mesopotamia before that.
The confusion between the Religion and the Banking system is what generates so much angst. Essentially, you are looking at a 6 Millenia long Ponzi Scheme, and a few Jews started it way back when. It could have been Zoroastrians, but it wasn’t.
FrankRichards post=1433 wrote: RE, The Russkis have been second tier players for all but 50 years out of the last thousand.
Russia was founded by vikings who weren’t good enough to become kings in the West or powers behind the throne in Constantinople. Who then got their asses kicked by the Mongols.
One of the few things the Brits, French and Germans all believe in is that Poland, Bohemia and Hungary are the end of European Civilization.
That’s a very interesting spin on Ruskie History Frank 🙂
However, I would make the case that the Vikings came into the game well after the Power Base had been established through the Mesopotamian and then Roman civilizations, and they were fortunate just to maintain their relative independence before grabbing hold of the Ruskie political system.
Far as getting their asses kicked by the Mongols, as you are well aware I am sure the Mongols were funded by the House of Medici, basically providing the Illuminati with the Big Ass Military of that time to run roughshod over anyone who would not Play Ball. The end result of course is the general Trilateral World power structure we have today of the Anglo-Amerikan and Teutonic Illuminati in the “West”, the Chinese Illuminati in the East and the Ruskie Vikings wedged in between. Vikings of course were never too good on the Political or Economic organization end, but were mighty good at Pillaging, Raping and dispensing Mayhem. They likely will repriese this role in the future.
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All the hullabaloo about the latest NSA facility in Utah got me to write a short article about this problem, which I think is over rated. I tried to directly link it here, but got back a message saying “You have tried to SPAM this site. The AUTHORITIES have been notified”. LOL Clearly, Admin here has dropped on a Spam Filter and I’ll bet my DD URL is top of the list of filtered text strings 🙂
Anyhow, this provides a pretty clear example of why the NSA actions are just a drop in the bucket here. Information filtering is happenning all over the place on Private Websites so unless you hunt really hard, all you ever find out about is the most typical spin.
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I watched a couple of DVs videos, they are a good primer onMonetary systems. However, he makes one contrary argument to his own thesis which I find appalling.
“We Americans have chosen the material benefits of being managed by the financial system for generations. We like demand-side freedom, i.e. choosing between Coke and Pepsi, but don’t want supply-side freedom. We like the supply-side to be taken care of for us. We love the benefits that come from it being imperially run—the credit card always works, the gas station is always open, our water faucets and light switches do what they’re supposed to do, the markets keep going up (oops…maybe not). All of our economic needs are outsourced to others, so we have the luxury of spending our time pursuing wants. And if these types of benefits are good for us, they’re good for the rest of the world. We have no moral authority to stand opposed just because we’re now going to lose our privileged position—a rather childlike perspective.”
Wait a minute…in his very first video Damon explains how ALL the conduits, including Media, Advertising and Education are controlled. On the one hand he wants to Blame All Equally, because the Victims here of the Brainwashing are “childlike” and WANT to be Imperially controlled. Where however is the CHOICE when you are conditioned from birth to want these things? Essentially, he contradicts himself because his philosophy doesn’t match the reality, there IS Blame here and its NOT distributed equally between the Victims and the Perps. Sorry Damon, that is just WRONG philosophy.
el gallinazo post=1380 wrote:
Let’s see, what did I say that was so bad? That Israel was going to force Obama’s hand earlier than he wished into a war with Iran? Looked at the headlines in the last couple of hours? Israel’s cabinet has effectively declared war on Iran by an 8 to 6 vote. Obama is probably not pleased with it due to his re-election campaign, but the real deciders in the USA have obviously also wanted to go ahead with it pronto. But being nice guys, they staged it so that Obama now just has no choice but to support an ally after the fact. The Peace Prize winner gets reluctantly dragged into another (really big) resource war. Otherwise the Enterprise and her crew of thousands would not have already set sail into her sunset mission.
OK EG, let’s assume the Israelis are going to go ahead with a First Strike. What’s the Target? Will they go after Tehran or a Military/Nuke Installation? How many missiles will they fly?
I can’t imagine they’ll pull a Nuke out of the closet at this point. They gotta wait to get hit back hard for “justification” for that. No Nuke (actually Multiple Warheads) the Iranians will definitely have some retaliatory capacity. Besides mining the Straights of Hormuz and sinking any ship that tries to move across it, what else will they target? Ghanwar? Suez Canal? Aswan Dam? Flooding out the Nile Delta would definitely make a statement.
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simon.dc3 post=1375 wrote:
Do NOT “jump the shark” by trying to have more frequent posts. Contributors like El Gallinazo risk putting the rest of you on the wrong side of legitimacy. Maybe on the flipside of Glenn Beck, but complete buffoonery nonetheless.
Oh brother. Keep drinking the Kool Aid there Simon.
Just to let everyone ELSE know, over on DD we WELCOME all levels of Conspiracy Theory/Fact analysis. We even set up a board specifically for these discussions. Im even willing to speculate that both Newton and Leibniz were Aliens 🙂
https://www.doomsteaddiner.org
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m111ark post=1345 wrote: It’s obvious that there are centers of power attempting to control world events. However, it’s the Debt-Money System that allows them to maintain that control. In all the post I’ve sprinkled about the internet, not one response has suggested the reader has grasped the consequences of bankster controlled Debt. Until the problem is properly diagnosed, their can be not solution.
You must have missed the thousands of posts I have sprinkled across the net on this topic over the last 5 years. Big Ocean out there.
Come visit DD. Debt is the Name of the Game, has been since the Dawn of Money.
https://www.doomsteaddiner.org
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YesMaybe post=1342 wrote: RE
What does FSofA stand for?
Fascist States of Amerika.
el gallinazo post=1336 wrote:
RE
I agree that the International Bank of Settlements in Basle is getting very close to the head of the hydra, but I was referring to the tentacles where they execute power; Washington and Israel for military and NYC, the City, and Frankfurt for financial. That said, I really do not know how they reach consensus on current strategies, though their multigenerational goals are obvious. I really want to learn more about their inner workings, but it is cloaked in shadows and disinformation.
Actually, the problem is not so much one of disinformation as it is information overload. Long before the internet was a gleam in the eye of Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Sergei or Suckerbug, investigators both academic and otherwise have been ferreting out connections, and nowadays the information available on the net on these topics is vast. The problem you have is that so many people have chipped in their 2 cents on this with “research” that sounds plausible its very difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.
Learning about the real “inner workings” is much like trying to ferret out the inner workings of a Proton. You can’t directly observe any of it, you can only observe its effects and then try to deduce from that how it is actually working. You accumulate as much evidence as you think you need and then make a hypothesis based on that.
I actually do not think the multi-generational goals are all that obvious, because as stated before I think there are several different branches of illuminati who often have mutually exclusive goals in mind. There is a Power Struggle at the top going on, of this I have no doubt.
I do not think the Frankfurt group has precisely the same goals in mind as the City of London does; I think the City is more or less lined up with Wall Street, and I think all of them are bargaining with Hong Kong and Shanghai for financial hegemony.
Millitary hegemony is another question entirely. The Ruskies play in this game much more than in the financial battles, though there has been some change there recently. However, if you trip back in time with Mr. Peabody to Peter the Great’s time, you can see it was that back then the Ruskies got cut out of the game the Krauts and Brits were playing. This culminated finally in Nicholas and Alexandra Romanoff getting filled full of Lead in a Ruskie Basement.
So one has to ask the question again – Cui bono? The nuclear thing is a total fabrication.
Here the Chess Metaphor falls to the Poker One as the better choice. Cui Bono? Why, whoever wins the game of course, whoever bluffs biggest and best and takes home all the chips. Big Players can work in concert together to push the smaller payers out of the game, but eventually that forces them to bluff each other. The Iranians represent about the last Independent Player in the game with a Deep Pocket of Oil that everyone else wants to bluff them out of. The Iranians have their backs to the wall now, and really they have to Put Up or Shut Up. They either will fold their cards or they will make one last big Bluff here, and in this case, a Bluff with consequences.
They obviously cannot win a War against NATO if ALL the players line up against them, but they can fracture the alliances. They can force the Chinese to make a play. They ALSO can go ALLAH AKBAR!!! and destroy pretty much all the Oil Infrastructure throughout MENA. They are geographically well positioned to do that with Conventional Missiles.
Those who seek to control this situation bet on a couple of things. First that its possible through a massive First Strike to take out virtually all of the Iranian offensive capabilities. Second, that the Iranians are not so Suicidal as to blow the whole fucking ball of wax to Kingdom Come on the Way Out to the Great Beyond.
Based on the behavior of the Mullahs to date, that last one is a VERY bad bet indeed. I have no doubt in my mind that if the FSofA or Israel undertakes bombing Tehran or drops a Nuke on them, they will let loose every last Chinese Missile they have purchased here over the last Decade, and you can be quite sure there are plenty of them outside of Tehran. Not just the USS Enterprise will go to the Bottom of Davey Jones Locker, probably the entire 7th Fleet will go with it.
Its a Bluffing Game though, and the Illuminati think they can out Bluff the Mullahs. I am not so sure they can.
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I for one look forward to EG fleshing out further his opinions on this topic. The line between “Conspiracy Theory” and “Conspiracy Fact” is an extremely thin one. For instance, just about everyone here now believes that the CIA undermined the Iranian political system by installing the Shah as a Puppet Goobermint, but if you went back a decade or so few people would have bought that as a Fact.
I do think that saying Israel dictates FSofA policy is something of a Tail Wagging the Dog argument. Israel as it exists now is a post-WW-II construct of the Anglo-American branch of the Illuminati. It was established as a Military Beachhead from which to control the Oil Fields of the Middle East. Its strategic position on the Mediterranean makes it a great fuel depot for Air Power projected around the region. Its proximity to the Suez Canal allows Naval assets to be deployed from this location also. Its basically a Fortress, but its not the Central Controlling Hub here by any means.
If you want to peg a hub where all the policy directing what both Israel and the FSofA are doing, its neither in the FSofA or Israel. Its in Switzerland at the BIS. If I were to give any advice to EG in approaching this problem, I wold advise looking more at the King and Queen in the Chess Game, rather than the Rooks and Bishops and Knights personified by the various NATO countries and Israel.
You always work yourself into a world of shit once you start making the question about International Zionism. While this is a component of the overall issues, its certainly not the only thing impacting on the monetary collapse and drive toward War, and making the argument about Zionism just gets everybody’s Panties in a Twist. Its like bringing up Hitler in an argument, as soon as you do it all rational discussion stops.
gezelle post=1309 wrote:
Even the wealthy and well connected will find that their stash of Euros will dwindle and buy much les than they had expected.Particularly true once the Euro goes the way of the Confederate Dollar.
Until the collapse works its way to Da Fed, the Black Market economies in these countries will Dollarize. Drachmas are likely to have about as much utility as a Zimbabwe Dollar.
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This presupposes that the Athenian consumers have some sort of Money that the Greek Farmers will accept for their produce. Right now they are getting Euros for them, which buy them something else they need, like say Diesel for their tractors. What happens when their Athenian Consumers of their produce can only pay them in Drachmas, which won’t buy them any oil to keep their tractors running?
I don’t vote at all, in fact I have never even registered to vote. I grasped it was all a sham well before I was old enough to vote.
If I could stay out of Jail and not pay taxes, I most certainly would do that. I do the next best thing, which is to make only as much as i need to and keep my tax liability as low as possible.
“Democracy” is merely a means to take Debt and make it timeless in the Sovereign State. Has nothing whatsoever to do with political freedom in any real sense.
Carbon waste life form post=1279 wrote: Hi rapier
Don’t you think that there might be a phase change at some point when the ability of the corporations to accrue wealth is thwarted by the level of damage to the economy? Like the break up of the Roman Empire?
A phase change is one metaphor you could use, but since.the outcomes of phase changes are predictable, I think the better metaphor is the Event Horizon, where what will occur on the Other Side is not knowable.
Its very common byextrapolating on past trends to conclude we are working into Globalized Neo-Feudal Corporatacracy. However, development of this model reqired extraordinary inputs of energy and complexity of which HFT Algos are only a small part. What occurs when these systems fail is not predictable.
The outcomes here are not written in stone, in Georgia or anywhere else. The opportunities for great change will come with the failure of the Conduits. You just better be ready for it when it comes, because its a once in Millenia Opportunity, and you will not get a second chance when it knocks on your door.
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buddha post=1258 wrote: Margaret Thatcher called it: “Socialism is great until you run out of other people’s money.”
No, its “Capitalism is great until you run out money to steal from other people”.
Fixed that for you.
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Gravity post=1241 wrote:
Overall, I hold the large-scale operation of secret societies to be incompatible with democracy and open civil discourse.
What Democracy?
daisychain post=1233 wrote: Happily, humans have an infinite capacity to learn, grow, and create culturally.
That is an entirely Faith Based assumption with no real evidence to support it. The size of the brain is finite, and so are the number of neural connections in there. Nothing Infinite there. Even the number of possible permutations of connections is a finite number.
In any event, even if you postulate infinite capacity for Homo Sapiens, the Planet we live on is not infinite in resources. The resources Greece actually has are not sufficient to feed the people of Greece, and they are as dependent on the Energy systems that have been put in place over the last Century as most Euro nations are. They can’t Reverse Engineer to an agrarian lifestyle overnight, and what education they do have mostly does not apply to their predicament either. They are no better off than the poor “uneducated” Okies were.
Greece will depopulate.
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I had a good deal more work necessary. Up in Alaska, I was quoted $300 per tooth to pull. Since I still have about 20, that was $6K. Dentures were $1500 for Upper and $1500 for Lower. So it was a $9K bill minimum, and I would not get to keep any teeth at all.
$40 to pull a tooth in Los Algodones. All totalled my Bill is $2200. I spent another $3000 on the Flight/Hotel/Car for $5200 or so, plus I get to keep a few teeth which makes a big difference because the Upper can attach to them and I don’t need a full palate covering denture up there.
The most interesting parts for me though was exploring the Border crossing issues. More on that now up in Part II
https://www.doomsteaddiner.org/blog/2012/03/13/res-excellent-mexican-dental-adventure-part-ii/
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Poverty is a relative concept. The Greeks are just the first amongst the “Western” nations that has to redefine their parameters for existence and what “poverty” means.
The fact is though that mostly Greeks will not redefine, they will evacuate. Greece will Depopulate as Ireland did in the Potato Famine. Where will they all GO? Mostly to the same place the Okies who pased on thru the CA Pea Fields went to in the Great Depression. See John Steinbeck, reference “The Grapes of Wrath”.
ashvin post=1201 wrote: [quote=Candace]So there’s a full global recovery expected?
I don’t get that last part either, but, no, there’s no full global recovery expected by anyone who has the least bit of awareness and common sense.
I don’t think AEP expects a recovery. He is a financial writer for the MSM though, so he has to throw in the party line Hopium.el gallinazo post=1186 wrote: RE
I read with interest your post about the Illuminati yesterday and your opinions today of how the dynamics of the factions within it may play out over the collapse. I tend to avoid that particular term to label this group for obvious reasons, but you probably have historical reasons for using it.
Which brings me to the point of this comment. As I am sure that you have gathered by now, it is an area of considerable interest to me, and I would be grateful if you could post several links you feel to be solid which describe both the history of the group(s) and about any factions that may have developed since its origins. The links would be sufficient and I do not need a long description or analysis covering each link.
Thanks in advance.
Your supposition is correct, there are historical reasons I plug in “Illuminati” as my most common term for the Global Elite. Mainly I use it because its such a loaded concept and really annoys a lot of people. LOL. However, my definition of Illuminati is a lot broader than just the Elders of Zion or descendants of the Plantaganets etc.
Yes also, I pretty quickly grasped that this area is of interest to you, and since I’m writing to grab interest from you and anyone else in coming and visiting with us at DD, I’m tailoring what I write here to do that.
Insofar as providing you with direct Links to other source material, Peter is a lot better at doing that than I am. Of course, we also don’t share the same opinions on outcomes here, but he has a great library of source material he has dug up, most of which I have read in the course of arguing with him about the nature of the game here.
For my part, I write what I refer to as Mr. Peabody History. I work from first principles of Human Behavior and then process all the bits of history I have picked up over many years of reading and spit out my own version of history that I think better fits the facts as they are apparent today then the history we get in textbooks or even in some old source material. My college girlfriend was a massive polyglot who could read Greek and Latin texts in their original form and we spent many nights hashing over the history she read. I refer to here as “Illuminati Spawn”. LOL. I personally had quite a bit of contact with the Rockefeller family in my youth, since my dad was an apparatchik for Chase Manhattan engaged in making a lot of bad loans to South American countries and acquiring controlling interest in local banks down there in the 1960s.
Anyhow, to answer your question would take a lot of writing here which would be better done on DD, where Peter is more likely to join the discussion. I invite you again to get your butt over there and register and stop LURKING! LOL.
To leave you thinking, consider this problem. Why do you think we see two different methodologies in play here for monetary collapse, deflation and hyperinflation? IMHO, its because behind the curtain up at the top, you have two different groups which are playing the game. One group would like to retain Dollar hegemony and so would favor a deflation, the other group would like to Hyperinflate it and substitute a new currency. the likely group for retention of the Dollar is the Anglo-American branch of the Illuminati, the HI group is likely led by the Teutonic branch.
BTW, you can directly trace back this dichotomy to two men, both inventors of the Calculus. Sir Isaac Newton on the Brit side, Wilhelm Gottfried Leibniz on the Kraut side. Its because of these two men and their respective discoveries in mathematics that the Brits and the Germans got there first with the application of thermodynamics to the Industrial game. The two men had a bitter battle and both had Egos greater than the size of the known Universe. That battle has never ended.
For more, I’ll see you on the Doomstead Diner 🙂
When you rent a Car with a Debit card, the Auot leasing company x tkaes a large deposit and charges it to your card, $350 in my most recent rental (today in Phoenix). You do not have use of this money for about 14 days AFTER you return the rental car in good condition. they use the Float to make short term profits on your deposit money.
so, in order to rent, besides the actual rental cost, you must have at least $350 EXTRA in the account you use for this purpose, and be willing to have it tied up for about 14 days. That is BIZNESS days also so its probably abotu 3 weeks or near a full billing cycle.
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gezelle post=1084 wrote: I am in NY, in an area which has one of the largest large Greek populations
out side of Athens. In the past few years, as children and grandchildren “made good” and moved to greener pastures and their Mc mansions elsewhere, the population has declined somewhat……this has recently changed.
My immediate area has seen a very recent influx of older to very old new Greek arrivals. Local residents are bringing their relatives, who were formerly content to remain in Greece over, and in large numbers. They apparently cannot make it any longer on reduced pensions and soaring food and fuel prices.
After a trip to the local cheese and olive emporium today, a chat with the owner
revealed that the young people are still staying away despite record unemployment numbers in Greece because we have so little available in the way of jobs for the educated young ones, and even family jobs, ie restaurants and small businesses here cannot accomodate their sheer numbers. Some are choosing to stay and fight, others are heading to Europe, hoping for some employment and life. When I see them starting to arrive here. it will be clear that the end is very near for the status quo.Gotta be Astoria, Queens around Steinway Street.
I’ll be interested to hear the on the ground reports from Little Athens.
pipefit post=1170 wrote:
I love a good conspiracy theory as much as the next gold bug, but the elite can kill the other 7 billion of us any time they want. They don’t need subterfuge. Why don’t they just do it? Are they like a cat that plays with a mouse, before eventually killing it? Doubt it.
First off PF, knocking down the population from 7B to 500M Georgia Guidestone numbers while still maintaining enough control to end up at the top of the heap in the end Game is a logistical problem of IMMENSE proportions, far greater than the measely 10-20M Mass Murder/Genocide sprees undertaken to date. If the Illuminati really could Snuff out the Useless Eaters that easily, trust me, they already would have done it.
Second, it is a canard to believe the Illuminati are a Single Organism with uniform objectives, they are not. There are two very identifiable factions there vying for control, along with divisions along Geographical lines and Cultural lines. Wht they share in common is they are all Power Seekers, but their interests often conflict with each other. they can’t willy-nilly Whack everybody, because each of them needs his own Army to protect and defend his Property. If you kill off too many of your “Loyal Subjects” too quickly, you lose your Power Base.
While most certianly in Absolute Numbers J6P will do most of the dieing here, BY PERCENTAGE the Illuminati will suffer much worse. this because they will Cannibalize EACH OTHER. Its an M&A Game on the Grand Scale, and only One Pigman can walk away with ALL the Chips.
Trust me, when there is nothing left to Loot from J6P, these Scumbags will be Looting each other, and Brutus will be stabbing Caesar inthe back all over the place. There is No Honor Among Thieves PF, not even at this level.
EG wrote: Well, I probably bought some phony statistics as real. I do admit that I was skeptical of them when I saw them. Both my parents were born in 1913 and lived in NYC during the depression, so I didn’t have to go to the library to learn about hard times. And they were psychologically scarred by it which got passed down to my sister and me.
All Statistics have to be parsed by using your common sense, particularly when stats reflect poorly on Da Goobermint. Far as the Great Depression goes, we KNOW millions of farmers were pushed off their land, we KNOW there was virtually no social safety net in place, and even with the missing data sets from 1931-33 the discontinuity in population growth trends between the 1930 Census and the 1940 one all point to a markedly increased Death Rate during this period. Add in the deprivation in Big Shities of the time (there were Faood Riots in many ajor shitties and the Bonus Army March was in fact one of many Food marches that went on in those years), and you can only conclude that starvation problems here were likely close to what they were in the Ukraine Holodomor.
As to whether our Goobermint was as bad as Stalin, Ashvin already has delineated how the Chain Gains were used in the South as a means to perpetuate Slavery, and what was the Death Rate on those Gangs? I won;t speculate on the Death Rate for WPA workers, but that probably was pretty high. There was no OSHA in those days, and they were working in some mighty dangerous places.
Then you have the evidence of Japanese-American internment Camps, and our current situation of having the largest Prison population in the world. Can you really make a good case it has beenn that much better here for the Poor than it was in China or Russia?
Greenpa post=1157 wrote:
Given two conflicting facts about “society” in general; most people will prefer to accept the happier version, on most occasions.
Simultaneously; presented with two conflicting assessments regarding your “self” (“You’re beautiful!” vs. “You’re stupid, fat, and ugly!”) – the great majority of us will instantly believe the negative assessment is more true; and agonize about it for decades.
I think those two statements are accurate. Possibly the evolutionary advantages lie in not instantly attacking and killing the liars in charge, which would certainly cause a constantly high level of societal chaos; and self-critical thinking might be expected to generate self improvement.
But it’s not a lot of fun. And connections to reality are exceedingly tenuous, at all times.
(aside; I DO like and appreciate the ability to edit posts.)
These are not characteristics of Iconoclasts, fortunately for me 🙂
First off, I never think anybody else can make a better analysis than I can, so if Da Goobermint Stats don’t match up with my analysis, they are for sure LYING. I GUARANTEE IT! LOL.
Clearly though, iconoclastic thinking is socially selected against, and we generally are not very popular people. this also doesn’t bother me, because I am basically a hermit and really don’t care what other people think of me 🙂 This frees up your thinking a lot.
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el gallinazo post=1136 wrote: Greenpa
“How recently have you read (or watched) The Grapes of Wrath?”
Asume your question is rhetorical but read it about 50 years ago and last saw it about 4 years ago. Bruce Springsteen’s Ghost of Tom Joad inspired me to give it another watch. East of Eden was my favorite Steinbeck book, which fittingly centered around a psychopath, although a cute one.
I guess it’s all about shades of black. However, one statistic which I read strangely enough stated that life expectancy actually increased in the USA in the 30’s over the previous several decades, as compared to 8 digit death tolls in Stalin’s Russia even before the war started with Germany in June,1941 when Hitler broke their non-agression pact.
The US statistic is still a bit of a mystery. One explanation is less food (skinny animals live longer) and another is wearing out more shoe leather.
OK, I took a LOT of heat when I introduced the following information about starvation deaths in the FSoA during the Great Depression on TBP, most specifically during the worst period from 1931-1933. Its researched up by a Ruskie Boris Borisov who may have an axe to grind here, but I did attempt to verify his statistics. Interestingly, the applicable stats are all maintained by Da Federal Reserve! It is also clear once you go into the files there that data from these years has been excised. Boris was working with old Hard Copies of these data sets in Ruskie Libraries. You cannot reproduce his work from data sets available online, the data is GONE. Seriously, its been wiped out. Go look for yourself. Relevant Data sets from 1931 and 1932 are simply not there.
Anyhow, we know from John Steinbeck’s news articles that in the pea picker fields of CA in those years, migrant Okies were dying by the truckload. We also have Dorothy Langen’s photography, which shows many people with clear signs of Starvation. It is not unreasonable based on all of this that the numbers lost in the FSofA during the Great Depression were near what Boris calculates them to have been.
Its not just starvation either, plenty of opportunistic diseases hit the chronically malnourished, and its well known that Tuberculosis ran rampant during the GD. Count in the TB deaths, you might come up with still bigger numbers.
Anyhow, I’ll paste in an article about Boris published by our friends at Pravda 🙂
RE
https://www.doomsteaddiner.orghttps://english.pravda.ru/world/americas/19-05-2008/105255-famine-1/
Famine killed 7 million people in USA
19.05.2008
Another online scandal has been gathering pace recently. Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, deleted an article by a Russian researcher, who wrote about the USA’s losses in the Great Depression of 1932-1933. Indignant bloggers began to actively distribute the article on the Russian part of a popular blog service known as Livejournal. The above-mentioned article triggered a heated debate.
The researcher touched upon quite a hot topic in the article – the estimation of the number of victims of the Great Depression in the USA. The material presented in the article apparently made Wikipedia’s moderators delete the piece from the database of the online encyclopedia.
The researcher, Boris Borisov, in his article titled “The American Famine” estimated the victims of the financial crisis in the US at over seven million people. The researcher also directly compared the US events of 1932-1933 with Holodomor, or Famine, in the USSR during 1932-1933.
In the article, Borisov used the official data of the US Census Bureau. Having revised the number of the US population, birth and date rates, immigration and emigration, the researcher came to conclusion that the United States lost over seven million people during the famine of 1932-1933.
“According to the US statistics, the US lost not less than 8 million 553 thousand people from 1931 to 1940. Afterwards, population growth indices change twice instantly exactly between 1930-1931: the indices drop and stay on the same level for ten years. There can no explanation to this phenomenon found in the extensive text of the report by the US Department of Commerce “Statistical Abstract of the United States,” the author wrote.
The researcher points out the movement of population at this point: “A lot more people left the country than arrived during the 1930s – the difference is estimated at 93,309 people, whereas 2.960,782 people arrived in the country a decade earlier. Well, let’s correct the number of total demographic losses in the USA during the 1930s by 3,054 people.”
Analyzing the period of the Great Depression in the USA, the author notes a remarkable similarity with events taking place in the USSR during the 1930s. He even introduced a new term for the USA – defarming – an analogue to dispossession of wealthy farmers in the Soviet Union. “Few people know about five million American farmers (about a million families) whom banks ousted from them lands because of debts. The US government did not provide them with land, work, social aid, pension – nothing,” the article says.
“Every sixth American farmer was affected by famine. People were forced to leave their homes and go to nowhere without any money and any property. They found themselves in the middle of nowhere enveloped in massive unemployment, famine and gangsterism.”
The then state of affairs in the US society can be seen in Peter Jackson’s movie King Kong. The movie starts with scenes of the Great Depression and tells the story of an actress who did not eat for three days and tried to steal an apple from a street vendor. There is food in the city, but many people had no money to buy it in unemployment-paralyzed New York. People starve in the streets against the background of stores selling a variety of foodstuffs.
At the same time, the US government tried to get rid of redundant foodstuffs, which vendors could not sell. Market rules were observed strictly: unsold goods should always be categorized as redundant and they could not be given away to the poor because it could cause damage to businesses. A variety of methods was used to destroy redundant food. They burnt crops, drowned them in the ocean or plowed 10 million hectares of harvesting fields. “About 6.5 million pigs were killed at that time,” the researcher wrote.
The consequences of those policies were predictable, the author of the article wrote. “Here is what a child recollected about those years: “We changed our usual food for something for available. We used to eat bush leaves instead of cabbage. We ate frogs too. My mother and my older sister died during a year.” (Jack Griffin).”
So-called public works introduced by President Roosevelt became a salvation for a huge number of jobless and landless Americans. However, the salvation was only a phantom, Boris Borisov wrote. The works conducted under the aegis of the Public Works Administration and the Civil Works Administration were about building channels, roads or bridges in remote, wild and dangerous territories. Up to 3.3 million people were involved in those works at a time, whereas the total number of people amounted to 8.5 million, not to count prisoners.
“Conditions and death rate at those works are to be studied separately. A member of public works would make $30, and pay $25 of taxes from this amount. So a person could make only $5 for a month of hard work in malarial swamps.”
The conditions, under which people were working for food, could be compared to Stalin’s GULAG camp.
“The Public Works Administration (PWA) bore a striking resemblance to GULAG. The PWA was chaired by “American Beria,” the Secretary of Interior Affairs, Harold Ickes, who threw about two million people into camps for the unemployed youth,” Borisov wrote. “Harold LeClair Ickes (1874–1952) later interned USA’s ethnic Japanesein concentration camps. The first stage of the operation took only 72 hours (1941-1942).
“In 1940, the US population was supposed to make up at least 141.856 million people upon the preservation of previous demographic trends. As a matter of fact, the USA had the 131.409-strong population in 1940, of which only 3.054 million can be explained with changes in migration dynamics. Thus, 7.394,000 people simply do not exist as of 1940. There are no official arguments to explain the phenomenon,” Boris Borisov wrote.
It is worthy of note that modern-day Russian patriotic historians reject methods of research based on the general estimation of demographic losses. They believe that demographic processes are not linear and depend on a number of factors. Such historians think that victims of communism estimations made on the base of demographic research works by Stephan Kurt and Richard Pipes, which George Bush and Helen Bonner announced at the opening of Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation in Washington, are false.
On the other hand, these methods are widely used in contemporary science of history. Ukrainian historian Stanislav Kulchitsky used the method to calculate the number of victims of the Ukrainian Holodomor (famine), which was subsequently officially recognized. Parliaments of eleven countries that recognized Holodomor use those numbers in their research works. To crown it all, the US Congress and the European Union also use Kulchitsky’s numbers considering the problem.
Dmitry Lyskov
Pravda.ruTranslated by Dmitry Sudakov
el gallinazo post=1123 wrote: Why am I always the fat one?
RE
“The main problem now is one of the resource base measured against the population base. Gold can’t solve that problem.”
Well if we could just get the population under say a billion in the next 15 years, I think we could solve that little problem. Only there is an appalling and disheartening shortage of volunteers. There might be a simple workaround. Kind of like the draft lottery in 1969, but with a diminishing list of deferments as time goes by. Only this is a big logistical problem. Might require German engineering.
BTW, I am glad that we have a constitutional lawyer as POTUS. Hitler and Stalin never had the decency to pass laws that they could kill anyone they felt like. They just did it. Very primitive.
To do a Population Reduction Quick and Sorta Fair, all you need is a disease vector with say 95% Infection rate and 95% Mortality rate, with no medical intervention possible. Then everyone regardless of class gets Whacked on an equal and random basis. You don;t need Hitler when you have the biochemists at the Whitehead Institute at MIT on the job.
Of course, our Illuminati Masters will no doubt be holing up in underground bunkers with their own filtered air supply, Hitachi Micro Nukes and Aquaponic Food production, but they’ll be a while in coming up from out of the hole.
However, I do wonder some about the economics of trying to scale down the industrial economy utilizing just what reasonably positive EROEI Oil is left, even with a much smaller population base. It still would not be a growth economy, and thus would suffer the same monetary problems any economy in shrinkage mode would face. it might though Buy Time for the Holy Grail of Cold Fusion to come riding to the rescue of the remaining population. In absence of something like that, I suspect the system would continue to deteriorate until you finally reach a population level of Homo Sapiens that is totally pay as you go on an energy basis without depleting the rest of the environment.
RE
el gallinazo post=1112 wrote: Skipbreakfast
The main forum window has exactly what you want….I think. It is the recent topic tab, second from the left. And it is arranged in descending order of most recent posts and gives the id of last poster. Check it out
The issue with Recent Comments is the listing format. You can’t scan through all the comments simply by scrolling down the page, you have to click the link to each one separately.
I am going to try to resolve this with Peter by creating a page which accepts dynamic updating, then give the user access to that page either through a Tabbed Widget or a Popup Window accesible off the Homepage of DD. The page will pull its content from the forum DB in Chronological order of posting.
Reverse Engineer
Eliminating Open ID accessibility only went back to last September and was part of the attempt to reduce Butthead’s disruptive activities. Unfortunate that it kept you off.
I don’t remember when it was that I last tried to post a comment on TAE, but I never really followed commentary here, just read the articles. Anyhow, after getting my ass booted off TBP I just holed up with my friends on Reverse Engineering, tired of the process of repeatedly being banned from OPBs (other people’s blogs). I just write too damn much and I have a tendency to overwhelm a board because of that. DD resolves this problem for me. Now I just link back to my longer stuff and say “Go read this” on DD instead of over-cluttering OPBs with what I write.
Anyhow, better late than never to arrive here on the shores of TAE, and in fact its probably better that this happenned because chances are you folks would have Banned me also. Everybody else has. LOL.
RE
@EG
Heeeeyyy Abbott!
Golden Oxen post=1103 wrote: @ Reverse Engineer. Then how did we make it to 1970.? What you are saying is you would have had to RAISE the price of gold and reward the people who did not fall for the paper con, in order to issue more bogus fiat. Since that would mean rewarding the wise thrifty saver and punishing the I want it now credit junkie, it is not comprehensible or convenient for you to honor your legal contractual promise and here we are today. That yarn you spun about saving the industrial paradigm by saying good bye to gold has to be satire. You will notice that the gold got to 1900 anyway, and the wise and thrifty who are still on the gold standard are doing okay, it is the fiat fools that are in all the trouble.
Clearly you have not yet read my Energy-Money Equilibrium series yet. You can start with Part 1.
Anyhow, up to 1970, the local industrial economy was run on its own local supply of Oil. Once the industrial economy and its associated War machine had to start importing Oil, it couldn’t be maintained without issuing the debt in ever more copious amounts as time went by. Nixon shut the Gold Window because the War Machine was getting impossibly expensive to run. Paid for in Gold at whatever Price, it would have bankrupted Ft. Knox of all its tungsten before we ever left Vietnam, much less got to Desert Storm.
Without the War Machine as a driver, the industrial economy here in the FSofA would have collaped on itself. Perhaps if there was some brilliant visionary leader around at the time who could have conquered the interests controlling corporations like General Electric and Lockheed a different type of economy than a War economy might have been achieved, but alas no such leader has ever appeared.
So anyhow, debt and fiat won the day over Gold because it served best the interest of those who run the MIC. The main problem now is one of the resource base measured against the population base. Gold can’t solve that problem.
RE
Golden Oxen post=1100 wrote: Why? What did you expect when the dollars link to gold was entirely severed?
Severing the Gold link was entirely necessary to continue on with the Industrial Paradigm, which inherently must be subsidized to exist. Steve on Economic Undertow explains this fairly well, though he convolutes the logic a bit so it is sometimes hard to follow.
I’ll try to simplify the concept some. If you take something like Gold which is relatively fixed in quantity and set it against something like Oil which constantly depletes through wastage, you get to a point where in order to keep buying the Oil you need ever greater quantities of Gold because the relative price changes. Anyone needing Oil gets bankrupted of their Gold in short order. so if you want to keep the Oil flowing, you have to issue Debt on the Oil and buy it with that, not Gold.
Had the Gold link not been severed in the 1970s, the Industrial Economy would have come to a grinding halt back then. The process of issuing debt on an unsustainable system is what allowed it to continue onward these last 40 years or so. A gold standard of hard money would not have salvaged the Industrial Economy, it just would have killed it a lot sooner. all to the good if that had happenned, but its ot what anybody really wanted, not even J6P. Certainnly not the Industrialists who were gaining more power than any King ever had in all of recorded histrory before this time.
Debt has allowed the subsidies for Industrial Waste and degradation of the environment to continue onward unchecked, which has certainly turned more of the Earth into a polluted Garbage dump than it was in 1970, but a Gold standard would not have stopped industrial society from crashing, it just would have crashed sooner. The real Value of gold is as much a chimera as the real value of fiat money. The main difference between the two is that one is relatively fixed in supply whereas the other is theoreticall infinite in supply. In both cases though, they are representing a real value which is shrinking relative to population numbers. the debt method allowed a continuation of the Industrial Paradigm, a Gold standard did not. Thus the fiat was chosen as the better method by those who run the Money show.
el gallinazo post=1087 wrote:
If everyone is leaving the stock market because they know the game is rigged, why has the market doubled since it bottomed out mid March 2009? Where is the money to keep Wile E. flying high coming from if everyone is fleeing like rats from a burning ship? Can pension funds survive on 2 or 3% long term fixed incomes when they need 6–7% to avoid a shrinking principal? Can your grandma? It’s a negative real yield even with the CoL numbers from the Bureau of Lying Statistics. Could the Fed possibly be trying to force these funds into high risk assets by their ZIRP policies? Who exactly owns the Fed, and which individuals own the banks that own the Fed?
Well, first off the Market can levitate with “everyone” leaving the “market” because Retail Investors, even Pension Funds do not have unlimited access to ZIRP money they can Borrow and then “Invest” in said Market. No matter how much money a TBTF institution loses, it can alway “double down” borrow twice as much as it just lost and bid back up the market with the new debt money. In Newzpeak, the Technocrats (Newzpeak for “Fascist”) call this process of perpetually giving new Debt Money to TBTF Banks “re-capitalization”.
The “Market” is and always has been a Rigged Casino, and even before HFT algos were Front Running the market, as long as you were high enough up the food chain you KNEW where the Big Money would flow and when. The “little investors” are suckered into the game as the Ponzi grows, but even if you are smart enough to see when its going to collapse its almost impossible to liquidate your assets if you have accumulated a lot of them. The TBTF don’t really worry about asset value collapse, because they can use their assets valued at par as collateral for new loans, and double down. Retail investor cannot do that, you actually gotta SELL your asets at whatever the market will bear to liquidate, and if its less than you paid for it and you bought it on margin, well you are just SOL there.
The folks closest to the Money Creation game never go broke even in a massive Ponzi collapse, simply because AFTER the collapse they are the first ones issued NEW money to gamble with. Why do you think that Money Creation has been so closely held as a private concern?
I know your questions as to who owns Da Fed are purely rhetorical ones, we all know who owns Da Fed, the House of Rothschild, the Rockefellers, the House of Morgan, Mellon, Kuhn et al, and in fact all these Corporate Entities are shells themselves with the controlling interest held through shadow trusts that are about impossible to trace out they go back so far in history.
Bottom line though, Money Creation depends on Resource Control. when you issue Credit to buy something, you must have control over the resource it buys. Since the Age of Oil began, Credit/Debt money has been issued based on control over the Oil resource. The resource is dissipating, as is the control over what is left of it. So even with the power of infinite Money creation, you cannot stay rich if there isn’t enough of the resource around the money is supposed to buy. That is a long term issue though, in the short term some folks at the top still have access to infinite money, while others are triaged out of their ability to access any of it. Read that the Greeks here first. They only get issued just enough to keep the Ponzi from completely collapsing in a Global Flash Crash.
Money that is created that is now NOT going into buying PIIGS debt is flowing toward equities, but really these are all Zombie Companies surviving on infusions of debt money. They are not organically productive in any sense. They’ll drop off the map here one by one as Konsumers no longer can afford to buy their products or services.
At some indeterminate point here you will get sufficient Political problems resultant from a collapsing real economy that the financial economy will “break”. We cannot control that through the political process, it is captured by the folks who control money creation in the first place.
The only way out is a complete crash, and its Coming Soon to a Theatre Near You.
Greenpa post=1086 wrote:
Anyway! Here’s the news! Greek credit default swaps ARE triggered!
https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/03/09/greek-credit-default-swaps-are-activated/
Recent photo of the Doorman at the BIS
I originally began writing on the Peak Oil message board. After being Banned there, I wrote on other Boards and Blogs, most notably TBP for a while. So I have a lot of familiarity with both formats.
The Forum format provides a lot more flexibility than the blog comments do. As mentioned, readers can begin their own threads, and you can sort the information contained inside better.
Anyhow, by coincidence we set up very much the same type of organization on DD, and making it all user friendly takes time to do, and it also takes the users willingness to move on. We’ve had a decent dropoff in posting from our regular members because the new board is just too BIG for them, they liked the small private Yahoo Group we occupied.
As to why I never posted on TAE before the new platform got dropped on, it had nothing to do with the chummy nature of the people posting. I simply couldn’t post, I couldn’t get the Open ID to work. Thus I avoided being Banned from TAE all these years. LOL.
I’m making up for lost time now. 🙂
Discussing the Geopolitical consequences of the MIC War Policies
https://www.doomsteaddiner.org/blog/2012/03/09/parsing-the-middle-east/
RE
