Forum Replies Created
“already suffocating under a yoke of extreme austerity”
The suffering of the poor is government policy. Many people say they object to Brexit because it will be bad for the poor. But in this country it is already bad for the poor, and if it gets worse, that will be government policy too. There is really no need for the poor to be so poor, but there is always an excuse. Last time it was the debt, which never got paid off, this time it will be Brexit.
I will not read Cameron’s memoirs until 70 years after his death, to be sure he doesn’t get paid for it, and even then he won’t because I will be dead too.
When Boris says the UK Parliament has no control over BREXIT it is a simple statement of fact.
I think in theory parliament could pass a law requiring Johnson to revoke or postpone article 50. But it might take them too long to do that.
If we had no food the army would take over the port and let the lorries through. If the French army tried to stop that it would be an act of war.
Why can’t we see the leaked document? Which way are the unready lorries travelling? Why can’t the customs just let them through even though they are not ready? People think the law is like a physical object which pins you to a wall or something. It’s not. If it is a silly law you can change it or ignore it. One of the EU Kings could just issue a decree in a press statement. People don’t even bother with the speed limit in this country, why would they cause starvation by stopping lorries?
Backed by the People’s Vote campaign and written by Dr Séan Rickard, former chief economist of the National Farmers’ Union, the report warns that 50% of farms could go under as the government would prioritise keeping down food prices for consumers ahead of protecting agricultural producers.
It’s only necessary to read this paragraph which shows it is pro-remain nonsense. How does removing 50% of farms keep food prices down? It doesn’t. It’s nonsense. Why is there pro-remain speculation in a newspaper anyway? Because the Guardian is a pro-remain campaign.
If they are worried about the value of the pound they could raise interest rates. No doubt they will say this would be bad for the economy. But devaluing the pound ought to be good for the economy. Does anyone understand it? How about printing some money and paying the poor to vote remain?
Our future is in the hands of unelecting Cummings? I thought it was in the hands of unelected EU commissioners? Well I don’t suppose it matters whose unelected hands it is in, the point is, they are unelected.
It isn’t normal to quote the exchange rate at an airport. But this is the
Independent, a pro-remain campaign newsletter for the gullible and fearful.
“Brussels must stand up for its member state, Ireland.”. Actually the UK is a
member state too. And article 50 is EU law. Who does the EU represent? Well
bankers, corporations, commissioners. I can’t think of anyone else.
• Mess With Good Friday And We’ll Block UK Trade Deal, US Politicians Warn (G.)
We no longer have a country. We’re like Germany after the war, with others tearing of pieces and saying “that’s ours”. Ireland, the EU, USA, they all are making grabs. I suggest Scotland and Northern Ireland form a seperate country inside the EU, while England and Wales form one outside.
Trapped in proverty? Poverty is government policy at the moment. It always is when the tories are in. They like poverty, for other people. “If it isn’t hurting [them] it isn’t working [for us]” Margaret Thatcher. [Brackets mine].
How can we distinguish between project fear and objective predictions about the future? We don’t see probabilities on anything. We often see the word ‘could’ followed by apolcolyptic predictions. We cannot trust the Independent or the Guardian, they are pro-remain. The Independent is the worse though. We cannot trust the CBI I think. Corporate interests are not the interests of EU citizens, bankers interests are not the interests of EU citizens. The ultimate utopia for corporations would be one world government with no democracy.
Now that the Tories have demonstrated that they cannot pay off the debt that they said they would pay off in 5 years, no one cares about it. It used to be an existential threat to the UK. It used to be frenzied hysterical apolalypse stuff. But we have a new apocalypse now, so no one cares about the debt. Why does the debt matter? says the establishment. We need to get rid of democracy first. That’s our priority. Then we can get rid of debt by introducing slavery.
Don’t vote. It only encourages them.
According to https://www.theccc.org.uk/publications/ we don’t need to change our driving habits. We just need to have electric cars. And then we need to have time of day tariffs, to stop the grid collapsing. This is madness. How much will electricity cost when it is used by all the cars?
As for Facebook, don’t worry, I am not on there either. I think it is a good place for the masses to congregate and leave the rest of the internet smart people like me.
Yesterday in Parliament the shadow home secretary spoke in defence of Assange according to my memory and this article:
“Diane Abbot has been criticised after defending Julian Assange following his removal from the Ecuadorian embassy and arrest.”
I suppose it is quite comical to try to stand up for democracy against the onslaught of totalitarianism and Guardian bigotry. So I give up completely. But what is the justification for this (below)? How does it help anyone? or is it just supposed to be a punishment for daring to leave the regime? It confirms to me we are absolutely right to leave.
I don’t know what happened to my twitter links, they should have been these:
t w i t t e r.com/JewishLabour/status/1115282710182989824
t w i t t e r.com/OwenJones84/status/1115299916602073090
But got mangled up somewhere into t.co
It is the right twitter link. It shows JLM responding to Leave.EU. I don’t think it does their cause much good because it makes it look like the vote was motivated by anti-brexit. I am responding mainly to the Independent article. It looks like a lot of mud slinging in all directions. What is the truth? Is the labour party or Leave.UK more racist than a random selection of people?
Firstly: antisemitism is real, it's a horrifying menace, and it must be defeated. Labour's own disciplinary procedures are out of date, not fit for purpose and need far reaching reform.
That doesn't mean The Sunday Times splash is accurate or fair. It isn't: and that matters. https://t.co/WOlvZk3ueA
— Owen Jones🌹 (@OwenJones84) April 8, 2019
What conclusions should I draw from this?
We also voted overwhelmingly to support @peoplesvote_uk.
You are a divisive race baiting organisation and we want nothing whatsoever to do with you.
Go away and leave us and other minorities alone. https://t.co/Ez8YaIUG7c
— Jewish Labour Movement (@JewishLabour) April 8, 2019
Look at this remarkable contribution to the debate on the revocation of article 50 petition:
I have questioned the Prime Minister, and I am confused. Why does she think it is okay for MPs to change their mind and vote time and again, yet it is not okay for the people of our country to do that? After all, every five years we expect the country to change its mind in voting in general elections. In fact, the Prime Minister wanted the country to change its mind so that the Government had a stronger majority. Clearly that did not go well for her, but that was after just two years. We are now nearly three years out from the 2016 referendum. My constituents are absolutely right to call for a public vote with the second petition.
Amazingly, she has completely overlooked the fact that Brexit has not happened (yet?). If Labour win the next general election, should we leave the tories in for three years and have another go?
(To be fair, it was April 1st).
Apparently optimism for a soft brexit has made world stocks go up. Wow! Such massive influence for such a laughing-stock country. But why don’t we let the markets run everything? Maybe because the markets just read the press. And the press just looks at the markets. No, let’s not go there, it would be a cliff edge to the abyss.
Quoting the Guardian article:
I expect the minority of dedicated white nationalists and xenophobes to throw the towel in
What bigotry. Nationalism is a rude word for course, but what happens when the EU becomes a nation? will remainers be nationalist? Oh no, leavers will be separatists. You can put a spin on anything, and the Guardian does. Totalitarians! Plutocrats!
I don’t know how we would get a national unity government.
As parliament agrees on only one thing: that it is opposed to everything, and it is too late to do anything now because of EU elections, I suggest that the queen dissolve parliament and revokes article 50.
In the longer term we could have a referendum on England leaving the UK. That would solve the Irish and Scottish problems. Maybe Wales would like to join us.
If we have another referendum do we have to take into account the two and a half year pro-remain campaign by the Independent? or do we just write that off as “news” about the future? Or maybe we just wipe the slate clean and have a token period of unbiased reporting.
V. Arnold: “zero sympathy for the U.K….Stand and be counted, or just go away and die…
“In all my years of commenting, I cannot say I’ve ever changed anybody’s mind on anything…”
That doesn’t surprise me at all.
Notice people (on radio 4) still blame the leave campaign for false promises and claiming they could deliver things which they could not. But the government’s own leaflet said “This is your decision. The Government will implement what you decide.”. But they have so far been unable to do this. You could argue that people didn’t know what “leave” meant, but it certainly didn’t mean staying in the EU.
They shouldn’t have called a referendum without having some plan on how to leave.
They’ve copied most of the laws into the UK statute books, so after we leave they can be changed by the UK government as required. How and when they come into effect I expect depends on the method of leaving.
But it seems we cannot leave because we are part of the Republic of Ireland.
The term ‘xenophobic’ was used in the New Statesman article.
Isn’t the UK system more democratic than the EU, with its non-elected commissioners who write the laws?
The characterisation of leave voters as xenophobic is bigotry. We voted for democracy. We don’t want to be trampled on by a totalitarian regime like Greece was.
We can still have immigration, but we can have immigration from other countries like Africa too. Why do Africans have to be excluded but not Europeans? is that fair?
Isn’t it generally the case that when people vote they don’t really know what they are voting for, because they are voting for something in the future? What information do they have to go on? the press, the media, promises, speculations, predictions. When people voted Lib-Dem in 2010 did they know they would be facilitating a Tory government? Should we rerun that election? The 2015 general election doesn’t count as a rerun of the 2010, those years are lost forever.