Noirette
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About the Mayor of Moscow, Soubyatin, ordering obligatory vaxes for xyz personnel, my prev. posts and some discussion, I looked a bit deeper.
He also wanted (ordered, decreed, not sure?) the closing of night-clubs and other similar, and parroted the necessity of a *sanitary pass.*
He is said to be anti-Putin and to be in the grip of a complexe occidentaliste. (= Admirer of the West.) His sanitary advisor (whose name I didn’t capt) worked at the European Medical Center (some unimportant outfit in Brussels, see link 1.)
Putin has consistently stated that the vax would be voluntary.
Now that is the past, as the central Gvmt. and/or the Regions (who have quite a lot of leeway, like US states) are taking decisions on this matter.
About 20 large towns are making the vax obligatory for many service personnel (restaurants, functionaries, nurses, etc.)
Putin himself is vaxxed. It is (afaik..) Medvedev (pres. of the the Party United Russia, Putin’s party) who is responsible for overseeing, coordinating the COV19 policy at the Federal level.
Reportedly, Putin has so far (27 June) refused to answer questions on this topic.
This all went down within one week. The Mayor of Moscow made his announcement, published his decree (oblig. vax) while Putin was in the plane on his way to Switz. > sneaky.
Peskov (Kremlin spokesman) was on air shortly thereafter, saying no, that couldn’t be, no way vax > obligatory. 2/3 days later he says he personally (not his remit btw!) is in favor of the Moscow measures, and 2/3 days later he says free choice holds as ppl can refuse the vax and quit their jobs.
—from F radio, some goog trans, and Moreau vid. in F (link)
So we are dealing with matters that are far more serious than just Gvmt. stupidity, fumbling around. Russia is following the exact same scenario as W countries (with Sputnik V vax, though some there are shrilly touting Moderna and Pfizer as superior) – going for vax +++.
Similarly, masks, gloves, distancing, etc. are still deemed necessary for everyone, vaxed or not.
The uniformity of the imposed narrative and measures it forces or promotes (vax, of any brand, continuing restrictions on movement, etc.) is very troubling — coming back to my main point.
http://www.europeanmedicalcenter.eu
xavier moreau video, in F
Other thread. madamski wrote:
— While I can’t certify that Putin is hysteria-free, his ordering a distrustful populace to trust him on this is the kind of gamble a person like Vlad doesn’t take unless there’s an urgent need and/or the odds are in his favor. SO I still think there’s more to this than standard government incompetence. —
I agree, yes, my musings were very general, the world has gone bonkers, hardly flash news, but there are degrees and tipping points.
Perhaps the key is that the Russian Vax is safe in the sense of causing almost no or very few bad adverse reactions / horrific results like three-days-on death, so the danger is low. (There are some studies, sorting that out is another topic..see one link) and Putin/ the Gvmt. of Russia, have the solid nos. in hand, and know this.
Moscow (16 June) for ex: …orders mandatory vaccinations for many workers
Presumably this order is within the remit of the Mayor of Moscow.
“We simply must do everything to carry out mass vaccinations in the shortest possible time and stop this terrible disease, stop the deaths of thousands of people,” Moscow Mayor Sergei Sobyanin said in a statement.</em
Dismaying! in its similarity to what goes on in the UK / USA / other W. Crazy copy-pasta.
https://www.dw.com/en/covid-moscow-orders-mandatory-vaccinations-for-many-workers/a-57920906
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00191-4/fulltext
prof wrote in prev. thread:
Madamski noted:
“It intriques me that Russia is pushing vaccination so hard. My hypothesis: they are scared of covid variants driven by the selection pressure imposed by mRna “vaccines”, so much so that they will risk considerable political fallout at the polls by imposing harsh measures to get them all vaccinated with a real vaccine that will help the body fight covid variants. They take people like Bossche seriously, methinks.”
But I would also add that here in Moscow at least, the traditional low credibility of the authorities ensures that voluntary compliance will be limited.
General comment…
There is an element of mimicry and competition inherent in this whole ‘reactions to covid’ and particularly vaxs, business. A kind of hysteria and group-think has taken hold, and it reaches high up, way beyond your frightened glued-to-TV watcher.
Of course, tremendous pressure via long-implemented corruption play a role. Corruption and partial take-over of int’l med bodies like WHO, country ‘ministers’, advisory, regulatory, control boards, Doc. associations, and many more.
The end result is pressure to vax, thru manipulation and propaganda, making Gvmts., those in authority needing to be seen to ‘act smartly’, provide solutions, do the ‘right thing.’
A ‘miracle potion’ (here a vax) is essentially a standard move to deal with a crisis (covid is not dire.. though I suppose made to seem so comes down to the same thing.. other topic..)
Plus, not to forget that Gvmts readily embrace reasons to impose restrictions, control, corral ppl, etc., and that profiteers, Big Tech for ex. producing covid digital passes, will jump eagerly on board to make money (or joined the planning long ago..) This is corp-state melding, an aberration, extremism, of the center.
Vaxs have become politicized, with countries / blocs only recognizing -abc- vaxs. Typically the West refusing to certify Russian, Chinese vaxs as effective or ‘acceptable.’ In this way, vaxs are assimilated to lowly consumer products (blocks on trade, monopolies) that exist merely for some to make a profit. It is clear that medical / effectiveness considerations play NO ROLE whatsoever.
Russia is not immune (sic), it is not outside this circuit and accepts the terms of the competition.
Recent vids of Prof. Didier Raoult, France, concerning only the patients treated in ‘his’ main center hospital in Marseille, one link below:
…. seem to show (he is cautious and always says ‘for now’ etc.) no striking / immediately apparent difference between vaxxed and non-vaxxed, as concerns,
> infections, those who test positive. 20% of ‘his hospital’ positives are vaxxed, and 25% of the population he sees – this is hard to judge of course, foreignors and so on – are vaxxed.
> severity e.g. becoming hospitalized or not.
// deaths are too small a no. to judge (on their own)//
One correspondence (submitted to the Lancet)
In our center, among 15242 patients followed up for COVID-19 from January 1st, 2021, 1213 were hospitalized (7.9%) and 125 died (0.8%) with COVID 19.
Among these, 545 were vaccinated, 62 of whom (11.3%, p < 10) were hospitalized and eight died (1.4%, p = 0.08). Therefore, vaccination did neither prevent hospitalizations nor the most severe forms…
Of course, vaxing ramped up over time, there were no vaxxed on Jan 1. 2021, a lot more detail / finer analysis could be done, not sure that woud be useful (particular context, small nos.)
.. in line with my stance for now that the vaxxes can’t readily be shown to do good or harm, in a meaningful, unequivocal way, at present.
Raoult, in line with your post (on video) has some data that shows *Infection* to be more common after vax (within one month, 1 or 2 doses) than without it, he says, we have to see, and wonders what is the mechanism?
So thsi all lines up though it is murky.
Raoult (in F no subs) June 8 2021
One thing that troubled me right from the start was who was dying of COV19. ??
I couldn’t grasp it. Clearly, factors, number one tops: Age.
Children weren’t dying but over 70’s were. Recall, there were all kinds of papers and analyses about who was most vulnerable, affected, in 2020.
I read a lot of those and even made a chart. Men were more vulnerable than women – died more speedily, earlier. (I even posted about this several times iirc. Women are infected more often because smiley jobs.)
Ppl with ‘compromised immune systems’ (vague, meaningless) were, are, ‘at risk’, as well as ppl with ‘co-morbitities’ like diabetes, a sort of catch-all for ppl who are more likely to be ‘impacted’ with anything at all and then die. Only one interesting ‘result’ (at the time) stood out – smokers were less affected; this was quickly denied, ppl were advised to stop smoking because! increased COV risks.
Afaik no medical explanation for the ‘old ppl’ deaths vs. middle age / youth was ever put forward, except old, more vulnerable, ill, compromised, etc.
I’m not suggesting the virus was engineered to impact old ppl (don’t think that is possible to do as of now), or to target ‘poorer’ ppl, e.g. in the US Blacks / Hispanics, with overall worse heath care, less good living / working conditions, etc. Nor that some ppl, say age 20 – 45 haven’t been hit very hard by COV19, with unexpected deaths, long covid and so on.
No solid medical explanation (that I know of) exists as to why in the say 20 – 50 age group one person suffers v. little, another is sick but recovers quickly, and another dies. Wouldn’t that be the first thing to investigate? Even thru some data base trawling and correlations? Am I missing something? What?
Basically what happened, imho *now*, is that statiscally expected, upcoming deaths were pushed forward by 2, 3, 4 months or a year or even more, and attributed to Covid.
By various means. Leaving infection pools to fester, sending old ppl infected into old ppls homes, refusing to treat affected patients, sending them home (in France, hunker down and take Doliprane), forbidding regular treatment with standard meds, bascially stopping docs from treating their patients following their ‘decisions.’ Isolating patients and depriving them of care, in old ppls homes, and letting spread take place in other places, like prisons. In hospitals, putting ppl on vents (e.g. in the US raking in money for that.) Plus what nobody wants to talk about, the *do no ressucitate* orders that were implemented in various forms in various countries.
my post about Dr. Qui was maybe ‘old news’ .. .. I revisited that today…what’s up now?
Here from 21 June 2021, UK Gvmt. Agency website.
Well well well. Out in the open now, an alliance between private corp. ‘social media’ and ‘Gov’.
Press release:
Leading social media platforms unite to support COVID-19 vaccine drive
Snapchat, Reddit, TikTok and YouTube have partnered with the government to encourage users to get the vaccine.
Things are moving forward very swiftly, it is almost like it was … planned with check points on a calendar.
Link (‘hype’ type, everyone is a spy, etc.) lists the pathogens sent by Dr. Qiu from the 4-level lab in Winnipeg to the Wuhan lab in March 2019, following a FOIA-type request in Canada.
*Backstory.* Dr. Qiu, her husband, and two students (one doctoral, other idk) were escorted out of the lab in Winnipeg in July 2019, and fired.
the site is ‘Great Game India’ (idk..)
from GGIndia. Quotes:
The shipment was routed from Winnipeg to Toronto and then to Beijing on a commercial Air Canada flight on Mar. 31, 2019.
The ATIP documents list the contents of the shipment including two vials each of 15 strains of virus (about 15 ml):
Ebola Makona (three different varieties)
Mayinga
Kikwit
Ivory Coast
Bundibugyo
Sudan Boniface
Sudan Gulu
MA-Ebov
GP-Ebov
GP-Sudan
Hendra
Nipah Malaysia
Nipah Bangladesh————————————-
Well when one gets into details like this, it is no wonder that lab ‘accidents’ happen. Except, maybe they aren’t in the lab / or close by it (waste water, pateient zero wanders out, etc.)
Putin’s press conference after the Geneva meeting. Eng transcript:
Listened to the poor simul. trans. in F. with vid, I ‘get it’ or like to think so. VP’s first remarks, left out in the transcript above, were very complimentary towards Biden, unecessary. (One can pass straight to policy issues, announce that the ambassadors are returning.) VP’s tone throughout was cautiously optimistic, not his wont. If, on the world stage, he is displeased he is poker straight-faced diplomatic, or shows his fury sub rosa. When happy, charmed, or amused, he shows it.
Ukraine. VP skirted mention of Biden. VP: ** I made it clear that the only action ‘appropriate’ is to contribute to, uphold, the Minsk Accords. Kiev-position is to re-integrate the Donbass, (re-take..) control the frontier with Russia, and hold elections 3 months thereafter. This is not acceptable. **
Of course, VP need state nothing more than Russia’s position, as the US backed off Nord Stream II objections, froze some military aid package, blatantly tossing Ukraine under the bus. It appears that Crimea was not mentioned at all , not one word..— so maps can start making it colored Russ. 🙂
Because (imho).. a) Bidadmin is desperate need to a return of EU support-submission to the US, which cracked a lot under Trump; Germany is the most important ally-puppet. b) The The US, EU are fed up with Ukraine – manipulating it, coercing it, is good for some hard cash (see e.g. Biden-Burisma), of course the geo. blocs, big corps, etc. have different rationales and aims, which clash, etc. but then?
Nothing turned out as expected, particularly for Merkel with her adoration of the boxer Klitshko (was supposed to be next Pres-PM-FM… but was demoted to Mayor of Kiev), the Ukr. was going to be yet another hinterland to be exploited by Germany.
Russia’s intransigence in the latest boiling over, provoked by Zelensky, massing 75K (or so?) troops on the border in the Donbass, has pushed the pause button which will now be held down for a very long time.
photo merkel – klitschko – yats 🙂
WES wrote: President Trump was impeached for suspending military aid to the Ukraine (something he never did). Today joe actually suspends military aid to the Ukraine. Shouldn’t joe be impeached?
Along the same lines… Trump’s plan was to ‘ally’ or cozy up to Russia, while fighting a ‘commercial’ and perhaps other non-kinetic war > China, in essence stopping the two others ganging up.
He was prevented from doing so by accepted by him neo-con advisors (never thought I’d see Bolton on stage again) and endless attacks on Orange Man Bad, Russia Russia Russia! screeched out by the like of R. Maddow, Dems, etc. Yeah, that’s the short version. He wanted (or said..) to withdraw from Afgh. He showed no interest in Ukraine whatsoever, let them solve their own problems.
Now the Bidadmin is implementing similar policies. Some kind of at least pause or temporary ‘hold-off’ in Russia-US relations, throwing Ukraine under the bus, withdrawing from Afgh. (complicated ..), and returning to the Obama Era by re-instating the JCPOA (in the sense of trying to do that..) And that is all SUPER COOL rah_ rah ! Dems or whatever.
Biden’s first foreign trip was to Russia (stopping off along the way to assure the EuroTrash that the US is still Master and ObimanEra is back after the Trump disruption – DT cared nothing for the EU and considered NATO useless..), while DT’s first visit was to Riyhad, then to Israel. He then flew to Rome, went to Vatican City.
In a way, seen from afar, it is plus ca change plus c’est la même chose. Bush Junior presided the creation of the GWOT, went for Afgh. Iraq… Obiman went after Lybia, Syria, Trump was dead set on attacking Iran .. Meanwhile KSA massacres Yemen. So what next with the Bidadmin?
It is like the ‘most powerful’ country on earth is in the grips of Mafia-like Struggles at the Top. *Taking for granted that none of them care for US ppl. at all.)
The article on Swexit was sorta OK. Skipping the comparison with the UK – they are too different to be useful for comprehension imho.
The number of EU_CH bi-lateral accords (not treaties; they are in the main commercial agreements) is about say 200 or more, not 100 – (it depends what you count) and they are a pain in the neck.
An infuriating (to some) and clumsy patchwork of piece-meal ‘legal stuff.’ Moreover, and here is the kicker – there was (and is) built into the overall picture, what is called the “guillotine clause” – which stipulates that if one, 1, accord is denounced by CH, all the rest fall flat, are nullified as well (total isolation! – this applies to ‘paquets’ of bilateral accords and not all of them.. more horrid detail..)
This dismaying situation was, is, the result of decades of drifting about, of quarreling around the edges, of compromises, good and bad. The guillotine clause was always hanging over CH! (And F, D, etc.) Both parties wanted to end this state of affairs.
Support from the Swiss ppl for an ‘institutional’, ‘supra-ordinate’ or ‘generalist’ accord – clarifying and settling all the issues was thus quite high, in 2015 or so, 64% would have voted yes to such an accord.
In 2020 that % was 22, and this March it was 15%. The ‘liberal left’ mentioned in the article is a tiny, really very marginal, part of the population. (Even that is a stretch, those for the accord come from all over the pol spectrum. Here the author applies his own lenses..) Even the Socialists – the ‘liberal’ left – have for the past 25 years not dared to speak one hushed word about joining the EU, they can foresee their demise.
in F. https://www.24heures.ch/une-majorite-de-la-population-est-favorable-a-laccord-cadre-419355155386
Yet, both parties soldiered on, neither of them wanting to stymie, spoil or destroy relations. However, it has been understood for a long time, 10 years or more, that certain obstacles could never be overcome. The PPLs party (so called populist right) adherents could never accept the super-ordinate EU courts.
The devil is in the details. One ex. re. the mention of high salaries in CH in the top article. The EU allows, nay champions, *detached workers.* Fantastique! Wunderbar! So Polish and Slovak guys and gals go and work in Germany and France, and they are paid …like in their country (the details are too bothersome, long..) These contracts are supposed to be limited in time, exceptional, only temp. but of course they are abused. It is a kind of legal ‘sub-par’ or even ‘slave’ (when sent by a company with no way out) labor, made ‘respectable’ by complex rules, bureaucratic obfuscation. (Almost) no Swiss ppl, not even Swiss bosses can accept this.
Switzerland has approved the vaccination of children as young as 12 without their parents permission from July.
–> posted by Germ.
Yes, that is correct. In CH there is a long tradition (libertarian, say) of letting children be free’ to ‘decide for themselves.’ Maybe 10+ or a bit more years ago, sales of alcohol became regulated to teens (16 years, beer, wine, cider ok, 18 years hard stuff), which never existed before.
CH was also *heavily* pressured by the US, to forbid prostitution (it is legal here) for ages 14-16, which was done (i.e. legal still after age 16 – which is in line with young ppl can decide what to do with their bodies..) Only a few rich madams in Zurich objected to the upping of the age. Did so publically btw.
Generally speaking the ‘age of decision’ or the ‘age of consent’ is 14, or 15, CH is a federation, it is hard to summarise it all. So why were ‘new laws’ restricting young ppls ‘freedom’ instored? To please the US? Ppl were furious.
The Med. decision thing was in line with the general directives – at age 14/15 children can decide for themselves. E.g. to have a quick operation or a long antibiotic treatment. Or no treament at all. (Orthodontia..is a prime ex.) An abortion, or not. An amputation, or not. Left in the community, in a psych hospital, or in a home for troubled adolescents, or not. This can be done when the community is soldered, young ppl have choices that others will respect, and will follow thru on.
However, that was never the case for vaccines, which previously were regulated by the Fed. State. No personal decisions were ever accepted, only Docs could decide (exceptions from vaxxes have always been easy to obtain, but it is the doc who certifies, it is not, officially, a personal choice.) Vaxs were under ‘public health measures’ and had nothing to do with ‘treatement options.’ Which imho makes sense.
So lowering the age of vax acceptance to 12 is a big scandal on two fronts; lowering the decisionary age; and changing the areas to which it applies. Not that btw any 12,13-yr olds will be rushing off to get vaxxed.
A reaction to Dr. D’s post on mills and the complex graphic he posted in the last thread.
Or rather! More for those who are into re-vamping non-FF tech to our present day, as I reckon Dr. D. knows all about it.
How to design a sailing ship for the 21st century?
Some ppl are trying.
https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2021/05/how-to-design-a-sailing-ship-for-the-21st-century.html#more
To get back to the story of the times, this vid about the swine flu of 1976, is a must-watch: glom the then-director of the CDC prevaricating / lying thru his teeth.
One can look up what happened to the swine-flu vax. Cancelled, after a small no of deaths.
Why young 15-25, volunteer for / accept the cov-19 vax?
— Technology advances, so do vaxes, this one is ‘new’, it is a modern thing, the publicity resembles that for a ‘new’ product, an ‘in’ thing like fantastic super fash shoes, a novel gadget, etc. Yeah, go for it. (=> Product advertising, placement.) I have heard this arg. from 15 yr. olds and 29 yr olds…
— I will be certified as vaxxed, get a ‘pass’ or other credential to stay / become part of the like-minded, or ‘top’ group – who can participate in xyz activities etc. Appeal to social identity, ingroup -> outgroup prejudice. ( => stiffer-armed marketing, skirting propaganda.)
—-I’m doing a good deed. If the only way to beat COV19 is via vax-immunity I’m helping that along. Here, the appeal held out is ‘to do good’ – as is done in pleas for charity donations to ‘ordinary’ ppl – a bearable dollar sacrifice accomplishes wonderful things elsewhere. The odd thing is that the vax is free and has no other obligations, which makes me think that the PTB were wary of this argument, but it seems to be quite common (ppl I have spoken to, internet boards.) Self-protection (I’m dead scared of catching covid) is as far as I can see completely absent, with good reason,15-25s don’t die of covid, which is perhaps why the ‘humanitarian’ argument is pushed.
— Low level marketing incentives to get vaxxed have been abundant: free beer, lottery tickets, etc. Quite odd, as it detracts from the seriousness of the matter (I want to protec’ my wife and the world’s children), so idk, is this corps. jumping on bandwagon, what? EU countries have avoided this move because it looks super scuzzy and will discourage ppl.
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/04/24/business/vaccine-freebies/index.html
Note: the Med. community has said nothing, has been completely silent, about these mini-bribes to agree to a med. procedure. ??
—The threat of exclusion thru authority from above from many orgs., high n’ low, e.g. no college without vax, no travel without vax, no sports team, choir, employment, and so on.
It is as if *every possible* psych-, advert -, propa-, order from above-, threat type- move was implemented at once, badly coordinated. It looks desperate.
Eric Clapton brings up some of these points, I was happy to see. Always liked him.
The announcer from the BBC vid up top, is clumsily reffering to this Gvmt. report.
It shows, on pp. 14-15 that for what is now called the Delta Variant (others are not broken down or analysed in this way, so it is a very partial analysis):
From Feb 1. 2021, to 7 June 2021,
23 unvaxxed ppl died, and 19 vaxxed ppl died, care of this one variant. (Leaving aside all the problems of testing, autopsy, etc.)
— for the details > table p. 15.
Imho, everything has been done to make these numbers toally incomprehensible, nobody can understand, analyse them properly. The definitions are shoddy, opaque, hidden, masquerading as ‘scientific’ ..
Note the death nos. are very small and not different between vax-no vax. So yes, the glib “50% of ppl who died were vaxxed” is basically correct. Not that it means anything. I wonder how that got thru / wasn’t cut off. !
The Time Cover, Biden-Putin summit.
My favorite park is off limits, shut off with barbed wire. (Say.) They will meet in the Villa la Grange.
https://www.geneve.ch/en/parc-villa-grange
Why Switz? Switz. only does UN approved sanctions (a reason why many think CH should leave the UN, which it only joined in 2002.)
Ex: The chief of Putin’s security team is on the US sanctions list. So the fellow can only travel straight by air from say Moscow to Geneva or Zurich – not to Paris or Rome (though he’d be safe in the Vatican) – not to or thru countries that supposedly apply US sanctions or are so to speak ‘occupied’ by the US. Which of course already evidences a high level of hypocrisy from the US, but that is an old trope, basta.
What will happen?
Nothing.
The Bidadmin is set on making things look good, or just, well, occupying the stage, any show will do! (after the evil Trump, who was vilified for being a friend or stooge of Putin, now a meet with Putin .. go figure..), relations with Putin can be improved, and/or, the Russians need to hear! listen to! hard talk, whatever.
The US team has not (afaik) put forward any proposals for an agenda with points that either need discussion or could benefit from such, the Russians have complained about this. We will see a lot of empty posturing, or closer to a bar-room brawl, in words, remember Biden, “Putin is a killer” .. and the horrid, insulting and empty, performance of Blinken in Alaska facing the Chinese.
Press releases will be *hot air.* Mentioning: A re-set; sticking points; etc. The meeting might even worsen relations via it being judged ‘useless’, ‘insincere’, ‘insulting’ etc. from the Russkies side.
Putin and Biden have met several times, Putin knows that Biden is a propped-up-puppet senile figure. (Was Andropov senile? I don’t recall.) Putin could not refuse the meet, these are moves that have to be gone thru.
Some of the recent moves of the Bidadmin have been ostensibly ‘in favor of’ Russia and Iran.’ Biden cancelled sanctions on the main cos. doing the Nord Stream II pipeline, which will now be soon finished, throwing Ukraine under the bus. (Ukr lived off transit fees.. Zelensky is hysterical..). The JCPOA is back on track, though it seems to have hit an obstacle just now, still Bidadmin tried to dial the clock back on that one (instigated by Obama-Kerry.)
Possible COV19 // precursors //
Previously discussed: Old ppl’s homes in Maryland – EVALI, the vaping illness – atypical pneumonia and other in Lombardy, Italy – antibody studies – waste-water studies – other.
Imho we can be pretty sure that COV19 was circulating in several places in the world from at least July 2019 onward. (e.g. Greenspring home USA outbreak, at that date.)
US tourist deaths
The Fiji couple.
David and Michelle Paul (30’s), from Fort Worth, Texas, fell ill two days into their vacation to Fiji, vac. from May 19 to 27, 2019. (Other news give slightly different dates, the fam. didn’t note the precise ones.)
Their symptoms were diarrhea, vomiting, numbness, difficulty breathing, shortness of breath, and they both died, with ‘proper’ med / hosp. care. The husband was put on a ventilator (from a 2020 article, quote of sister.) Five ppl whom they had contact with were also hospitalised with similar symptoms, and one other article mentions 2 security guards and 2 med staff who were put into isolation. (All links are to MSM, and the details I report are not all to be found in them, one needs to read a big no..)
Article – https://fxn.ws/3pDywlj – headline *mystery virus*:
An investigation into the cause of their deaths is ongoing, but a recent World Health Organization alert warns of a deadly influenza strain, including in Fiji where it is “particularly affecting young adults.”
I couldn’t retrieve that alert – WHO has been doing a lot!! of updating – redirecting, aka scrubbing. Also this one, which may be what was being reffered to, is gone:
(via Goog). 27 May 2016 — Fiji is now reporting a surge in cases of severe acute respiratory illness, particularly affecting young adults, including four pregnant women who … ((died is the last word))
An academic paper on the SARI (the I is for Infection) outbreak in Fiji 2016.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6053106/
The CDC, the WHO were involved in testing/figuring out what caused the Paul deaths. No cause of death was ever identified / made public.
I’m not claiming this was COV19, just when one starts looking, all kinds of strange certainly (imho) viral maladies, similar in symptoms to COV19, emerge (sic.)
Dominican Republic US tourist deaths
This involved far more sick ppl. and deaths.
bbc June 2019.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-48665796
Article hints at tainted alcohol from the ‘minibars’ as a cause (out of the question imho) but lists internal bleeding and fluid in their lungs for some deaths and pulmonary edema and respiratory failure for another.
CBS has a list of US tourists who died (May 2019 or so) from ‘illness’ – causes quoted: pulmonary edema for several of them – struggling to breathe – death certif. respiratory issues – fluid in the lungs – respiratory failure – heart attack – respiratory issues – fluid in the lungs – resp. problems – pulmonary edema – resp. distress…
ex. no cause attributed: “Allen was there with friends who said he complained about being hot at the pool before going to shower and lie down; he was found dead the next day.”
the list goes back to 2018….:
see also
🙂 Noirette sees COV19 everywhere 🙂
A proper worked out history would analyse and integrate these episodes.
Why didn’t locals die? Only the tourists? While one might imagine some deaths being either not noticed or deliberately covered up / neglected …For sure the local authorities would collate hotel maid, bar man, (etc.) deaths and claim some general ‘thingie’ and take some action? – didn’t happen.
The vaxxing of children and/or glorifying them if they decide to embrace the jab, when given the liberty to decide on their own (in some places from a v. low age x), is absolutely terrifying.
Echoes of ‘gender change’ where pre-pubescent children (and their parents who are in fact instigators), on the child’s say-so are allowed to radically transform the biology / body of the child (puberty blockers, later, operations, etc.) because those children are glorified as *special* near *holy* etc.
The family no doubt gets paid (thru med. insurance, stipends, support, etc.) and the parents can become facebook figures and even maybe grab 15-minute-fame TV! The children are admired icons for a while – and life-time clients of BigPharma-Med.
Part of the “tech and modern science” CAN trump Nature message – as long as profits can be raked in… What happens after they, the cute kiddies, prancing in skirts, or frowning ‘real bad’, have been used? Dismaying. Horrifying.
Prof. Chossudovsky, an economist, interviewed (audio) by Guns and Butter, about a year ago.
He relates the ‘pandemic’ to economic issues, saying for ex. that ‘the virus’ is used to implement drastic changes in trade, transport, economies. He opines it isn’t *bio-warfare”, or not in essence so, but has been actioned to concentrate money-wealth in the upper strata. He speaks about the biggest world-wide transfer of wealth – in modern times. He has it in for the WHO, in a big way, he returns to this point several times. (Sees them as totally complicit).
One hour.
This is *part* of the reason why so many different companies, organisms, groups, got on board with the MSM – Medic – Gvmt. panic scenario, or decided to stay silent and ‘wait and see’, trying to dope out where their interests would be best served / protected.
a must-watch. 4 mins.
One year prior to Covid, Belgian virologist Marc Van Ranst boasts to his colleagues about his psyops operation during the Swine Flu scamdenic of 2009. Laughing and joking, he exposes how he manipulated the media, triggering a sudden obsession with fatalities while creating pent-up demand for a useless vaccine whose side-effects ruined the lives of many thousands of unsuspecting adults and children around the globe.
Snipped from a talk he gave at the prestigious “Chatham House” in Jan 2019. The audience laughs when he details how he fooled ppl. Eng.
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/virus-psyops-exposed-2019-01-22_2gvfnsOjlJCDiDE.html
Roboto wrote previous: I know I said this in the previous thread, but that may have been after most readers stopped reading that one. I have essentially realized that the most “Covid-compliant” types are really just Hillary Clinton’s creepy cult from the 2016 Election. One reason I was so resistant to realizing that for so long is that the worst of Donald Trump’s creepy cult (mostly the QAnon crowd) have been piggy-backing their crazy-talk on Covid-narrative skepticism.
Yes, and this ‘sociology’ is not limited to the US. In F and Switz. it is the Socialists who are gung-ho for lockdowns, controls, curfews, vaccines, masks, punishments for nay-sayers, etc. European Socialists are not equivalent to Dems. politically but occupy a similar position society-wise on this.
Those against the dominant COV-19 narrative and its imposition come from the working class (e.g. Gilets Jaunes, a new ‘economic’ uprising, now killed off by the State (Macron) and cov-19, similar to US deplorables..), from the far right (if that has any meaning these days..), and from the remnants of what I call the ‘true left’, ex. Communists (or sympathisers) in France, Worker’s Party in Switz, or in GB the ‘old’ Labor, oriented to the working class (Tony Benn, last vestiges Jeremy Corbyn, pushed out.)
Libertarians are obviouly scathing about the strictures, a more purely ideological stance, less related to pragmatics.
So, this lockdown-vaxx-hyper scare-control scenario is fundamentally neo-liberal, and the neo-libs seem to be ‘running’ the ‘developed’ West. (Btw, Jacinda Ahern is a third-wayer, a Blairite.)
Essentially what we are seeing here is the top 20% (not the top economic 20%, but those with social capital, sitting on decision nodes, in the media, holding important positions, being top professionals, or ‘stars’, etc.) supporting the scare pandemic and the attendant coercitive and unreasonable or even highly damaging (from a health pov) moves, demands, rules, — for their own interests.
These interests are those of the professional-managerial-class and their hangers on, those who are dependent on it, plus those who hope to join. People who don’t work on the ground, aren’t ‘essential workers’ (deplorables), etc. They accepted or promoted lockdowns, because the lockdowns would protect *them* (no busy transport, office, lunch), love ‘vaxxes’, because these are a badge of adherence to the narrative, not a health move, and enjoy stiffing the deplorables, which was covered up by clapping for health workers and that kind of ludicrous sh*t.
If the truck drivers in the US went on a national strike the neo-libs would change their ‘values’… slowwly. Hooww? Could this happen? They would moan. However with corrupt Unions etc. there is little chance of such a correction or re-set.
Some links of interest.
NO JAB for me. 36 langs. have a look.
WHO tracking of cov2 variants.
https://www.who.int/en/activities/tracking-SARS-CoV-2-variants/
DRASTIC research group
To continue along the ‘globalist’ theme, Fauci / the US / is just one actor re. collab. / payment to Chinese Labs, particularly the P4 lab in Wuhan.
From France:
In 2018 Macron visited China. He signed an accord to continue (note, continue) collaborating w. China on infectious diseases. (Collab. is of very long standing..)
The then director, Yuan Zhiming of the P4 lab in Wuhan, studied in France. According to him (no surprise) the lab was set up partly as a reaction to SARS. A ‘good’ part of the setting up was paid by France, I’m not confident about the details, the sums *reportedly huge* so leave it aside.
The Macron visit was after a visit by Cazeneuve, French PM, in 2017, to the Lab itself.
Caz declared that France would support the lab to the tune of one million Euros every year for 5 years. (That was the promise, idk if paid.)
link in F, i posted the essentials.
http://french.china.org.cn/china/txt/2018-04/18/content_50906146.htm
Several other collaborative endavours were set up. Here is one example from the Insitut Pasteur, France.
A 4-year research group (meaning it is set to go for 4 years), again in 2017, between the Insitut Pasteur and the Chinese Academy of Science, to study infectious, tropical, neglected diseases. A top F minister was there to oversee the signing of the accord. (Le Drian!) This collab. was planned way back in 2004, by Jaques Chirac, and the 2017 thing is a continuation. (gen. article, second link.)
https://www.franceculture.fr/sciences/le-laboratoire-p4-de-wuhan-une-histoire-francaise
Here is a v. short report of the second Franco-Chinese summit on infectious diseases held in Wuhan, 2012. Session 3 is devoted to vaccines.
https://www.academie-medecine.fr/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/tap-p.1477-14791.pdf
(Some lab rats in F have been learning Chinese. Good pay in view.)
Big Pharma, in lien with interested parties of various types, even if confusedly for now (tech aka internet, social media, MSM, internal security, military for some part, ,..all supported by the MSM) has always aimed for the complete control of illness, its diagnosis, treatment. Aka, the conditions allowed for life, and the decisions concerning death.
Irresistible: the opportunity for total control of ppl’s lives, how they are lived, how and when they die. Potentially, it is an alliance between Big Pharma and Big Tech. Both are trans-national, global. The beginnings are imho visible today. (Face-book and Pfizer for ex.) Senile Biden or Servile Macron are mere posturing figureheads, the myth of rivalry between Nation-States in kept alive as it makes ppl adhere to what they see as their Nation’s leaders, or their oppponents, in a divide-to-conquer scheme.
A first aim is to remove Docs. on the ground entirely. (They are *very* expensive middle-men.) Only ‘nurses’ and ‘aides’ acting on orders doing scut work will be needed. Already, as we can see, docs. can’t prescribe or treat patients as they wish, and are being deprived of licenses, arrested, whatever -> to serve as examples. Where I live, docs. are more or less controlled by insurance companies (i.e. straight out rapacious money-makers.)
Patients will be treated by Super-Ordinate (aka Corp!) agencies via algos, be it for infectious diseases or medical procedures, meds. for long term conditions. Surgeons who obey orders are thus still needed. The COV19 ‘pandemic’ is to be seen as a first step in a long process.
All the State, Corp, International, reactions to COV-19 can be seen as going in that direction. Many of the Personnel of Gvmts. in ‘W democracies’ would be super pleased to have their responsibility for ‘health’ removed, outsourced, so to speak, to external, “wiser”, “better informed” (global) agencies. (See also the recent reliance on WHO directives.)
OK that was the +++ conspiracy side of my thoughts on the organisation of health care.
previous thread:
Dr. D thanks so much for the reminder re. Solzhenitsyn.
Huskynut wrote: Can someone pls help me understand why the Chinese doc applying for a vaccine patent in Feb 2020 is supposedly so terrible?
The lab was doing gain-of-function research. The stated purpose of GoF research is to be able to develop remedial treatments in advance of an actual pandemic. In the course of that research they very likely made advances that could potentially be monetised following the outbreak of Covid, regardless of whether the lab was the source of the precise virus that we now know as Covid. (…) .. how the patent application is evidence of any kind of smoking gun?
The ‘smoking gun’ story is based on a simple reading of the relation between disease->vaccine. Say in Feb. 2020: Bad disease, a pandemic, unknown how to prevent it or cure it. A plan to prevent it with a vax was in place at the same time — Ergo, the Chinese (others?) created the virus (or were aware of it..) as they pre-emptively sought to ‘prevent’ it.
Imho, Huskynut, GOF research – or perhaps more accurately! bio-weapons research – is perforce concentrated on both the creation of ‘killers’ (here viruses) and ‘protectors / curers’, the two go hand-in-hand, like missiles and anti-missiles, say.
Plus, from a purely scientific pov, it is understandable. Creating – applying “X” that produces or augments some effect due to some causation must quite naturally if only on a theoretical level be accompanied by what does (or could) reduce or negate the effect. Otherwise one hasn’t understood anything much, and surprises will follow. Yes this a mechanistic interpretation of “Science” but so it goes.
To add, I think the schema: create a problem, alarm, hype it, it is ohhh! All A Disaster! to then propose a solution that can be monetised, is a template that shouldn’t be applied to COV19, it is more serious than that.
WES, happy wedding anniversary! Congrats.
Now here is a strange thing. For reasons local, and re. long interest in waste, I keep my eyes on rubbish bins, and the like. When I walk out of my flat, up a small road, I face a large wheelie bin (Brit terms, idk US, garbabe container?), it is very dark grey, and it has on it side, in caps, in white spray paint, WES.
It’s graffiti, and not municipal tagging. It has been there for about a year and was not removed, I suppose because it isn’t ugly or insulting (as opposed to TUER LES 1235 – Kill the guys who live in x district), and it was only last week I made a link with a poster on TAE. I have no idea where this WES sign comes from / what it means. Anyway there it is, someone in the world somewhere has made a link between graffiti on a garbage bin, and you, one person living in the US.
The intertubes, man. 🙂 🙂
Precursors to the discovery of COV19 in Wuhan, from Europe.
The imho no doubt largest Chinese communities in Europe have been and are (> 2020) in Italy. Northern Italy – the top hotspot for COV19 for a long time. Plus Tuscany.
Numbers are hard to come by, as ‘ethnicity’ is not a category used in the EU. For N. Italy, it seems Gvmt sources claim 100K Chinese inhabitants, reasonable estimates, 150K, others, 200K.
Idk, might be more, illegals (= many) are under the radar. You can’t see it if you drive around as a tourist, as they live in industrial / close to industrial / specific villages that are not visited/ etc. spots. (I visit N. Italy often, family.)
They are employed in, and now a large part run the ex-Italian textile, leather, apparel (e.g. + handbags) industry. Look up Louis Vuitton and others, all will tell much of their merch is made in Italy. (They can’t say made in China for reasons legal / of image, so ..workers were imported.)
In 1998, It. law changed and Chinese citizens were able to own bizness. (as opposed to being exploited employees.) Of course there are sweat shops all over the place still today, but since then, Chinese entrepreneurs could open their own biz, and they employed compatriots. And many have been extremely successful.
Arte docu. about Prato (Tuscany). It is about Chinese youth in Prato, their lives, their schools, hopes and dreams. (All the images are from Prato. Speakers It. + Chin. w. F or D voice-over.) 25 mins., good, even for just a look at some shots. Note: this is not just a cute show about some foreign uprooted community: 20% or more of the inhabitants of Prato are Chinese, or by now, hopeful Chinese-Italian, in the sense of Chinese youth hoping to become Italian. (Intermarriage has been nil or close to, imho.)
Point is, the biggest consistent exchange of ppl China-Europe has trad. taken place between Wenzhou and N. Italy, thru Malpensa airport. Is that of relevance for Covid? Maybe, maybe not. Note some regions in China and Italy (N) share characteristics, ginormous use of electricity, dense pop. in some spots, manu-factories all over, working 24/24, etc.
Precursors to the discovery of COV19 in Wuhan, from Europe.
The French delegation to the Wuhan Military Games, some dismaying number but not everyone, fell sick as dogs. With the typical Covid Symptoms. (None died afaik.)
They couldn’t understand it and found it excruciating to compete, didn’t win many medals. One F competitor woman, Elodie Clouvel (goog) was indeed quoted in several MSM outlets (she did win a medal, popular woman athlete) about a peculiar sickness, her companion in another team fell sick also.. many others…
A gossipy F MSM link, also details Swedish athletes falling ill.
Another F MSM, athletes real sick, etc.
It was widely opined at the time that F milit. athletes weren’t able to compete at top form, etc. (The food? The flu? etc.)
Here is the telling bit, the F MSM immediately published that there was NO WAY the French delegation to the Wuhan Games caught Covid, once covid became a ‘thing.’
quote:
Au ministère des Armées, on a été demandé aux athlètes de ne pas répondre aux questions sur ce sujet avant de transmettre un communiqué sur la santé des membres de l’équipe de France militaire. Il n’y a pas eu, au sein de la délégation française des Jeux militaires mondiaux, de cas déclarés auprès du Service de santé des armées de grippes ou d’hospitalisation pendant et au retour des JMME, pouvant s’apparenter, à postériori, à des cas de Covid-19, a réagi le ministère des Armées, qui ne précise pas si Elodie Clouvel a été ou non en contact avec des médecins militaires pour être testée ou comparer ses symptômes de l’époque avec ceux du nouveau coronavirus. La délégation française a bénéficié d’un suivi médical, avant et pendant les jeux, avec une équipe médicale dédiée composée de près d’une vingtaine de personnels souligne encore le ministère…
https://bit.ly/3bZEBTx – France Info
paraph.: Army personnel are strongly advised not to answer questions (i.e. forbidden..) No infections occurred, none were declared, no hospitalisations took place. The F delegations to the Wuhan games had Med. supervision all along, 20 staff, test were carried out, etc. “Move Along Nothing to See Here” was the message.
On, Rand Paul (vid at top.)
He brings up some good points, sure he ‘ – a politician, not a neutral scientist. (If any neutral scientists ever existed, other topic.)
Science has been ‘weaponized’ – that is, used, roped in, to achieve aims that have by defintion nothing to do with ‘science’, a shoring up of an ‘Authority’ that resembles Religous Authorities of the past.
For ex. Follow the Science as adressed to the general public means: shut the f* up and do as you are told. Obey the Priests…or be an oucast…
The underlying aims are related to money (greed), control, domination, and, if confusedly for now, throwing over the post WW2 International Order (Westphalian Nation-States cooperating under some kind of International or ‘world’ rules and conventions, even if this was, is, somewhat illusory..)
What R. Paul leaves out is that research of the kind he talks about (top level micro- bio-organism research, mostly on viruses and bacteria, of various kinds, including gain-of-function, genetic manipulations, etc.) is an international endeavour.
There is a consequent + tight Int’l community collaborating on all this, and until not too long ago (2010 or a later..?) that was considered positive, in fact, researchers were chivvied into getting in touch with ‘colleagues’ (even when they didn’t speak the same language), collaborating, trying to write grant proposals together, etc. The meme that ‘top talent’ and ‘brilliance’ *has* to get together, work together, was touted, and a kind of heh, ‘we are all on the same page’ atmosphere prevailed.
Scientists were encouraged to pose on ‘community varied pix’, that is trivia, but meant to show that collab. is a main point, and via collabs. and coops. and University-Commercial Labs-Gvmt organised partnerships, much could be accomplished. Many were encouraged to ‘get onto’ projects they knew nothing, or cared nothing, about.
To advance your career (at say age 28 or 34 or…) in microbiology, bio-technology, high tech applied to medication..) you needed to publish, aka be an ‘author’, at least 20 papers with a ‘varied’ (international) team. In short, it is more like product placement than serious research.
The NIH funding the Wuhan Lab via a Fauci donation to Peter Daszak, EcoHealth Alliance, see their site:
Is nothing special.
Practically all the research into these kinds of areas in the ‘West’ is run by Consortiums, usually called public-private partnerships, and on paper, provided one can find the relevant docs, generally include a large panoply of donors: States, non-profits, Associations (though that is not a thing in the Anglo World), Foundations, aka non-profits, Commercials aka Big Corps, others, etc. And all these entities (except in principle, States which don’t accept money) shift large sums around amongst themselves.
Kicking in open doors, the Partners of EcoHealth alliance, from their site, look at the long list:
Includes natch’ John Hopkins, the CDC, the NIH.
R. Paul is cherry picking one mini-example for political gain. OK I’m not against, good news. Would he denounce the whole structure of Med. Research in the US? Could he? Probably not.
On: Facebook no longer treating ‘man-made’ Covid as a crackpot idea.
Facebook (not only, other ‘social’ media platforms) are “controlling the narrative.”
Accusing China / the Wuhan Lab for an accidental or deliberate release of a lab-made virus was previously labelled highly dangerous disinfo.
Now it is cool, a serious claim, a “talking point” and most likely.. gasp .. clutch pearls.. or bow heads in despair…true!
When Trump said he saw evidence the virus was made in China (like children’ shoes, or sexy underwear, in the US!..) he was vilified as a racist, war-monger, idiot, etc.
He de-funded WHO (WHO protects China, its main ‘country’ level funder) – in fact only putting the contribs. on hold. The Biden Admin. re-instored US WHO funding, and is surfing on the same China culpable theory, like more investigations are needed, etc. etc.
Clearly Facebook and Consorts have had to sharply dial down their money-making model: rope ppl in as users, keep them in, allow ‘free speech’ and practically anything to keep ppl online, gather data, sell it, boost advert. income. Ultimate aim: to kill off trad. paper and TV news.
They have been threatened with shut-down, so they have become even more blatant (as compared to TV stations, MSM news like NY Times, WashPo, etc.) with their censorship, algos, etc. A direct consequence of the fact that they don’t control the ‘official news’ which comes from the PTB (like Pravda, ‘news’ is what they are told), but the reactions and opinions concerning it are in their purview, and theirs to control, in a kind of techno-fascist Huxley-an world, and that is an extremely powerful, lucrative position, which did not exist in USSR Pravda times.
Suddenly “China did it” (let the Lab-Corona virus loose on the world) is again legit. news!
Let’s not forget that much of the agitation in the MSM and on Social Platforms is there to keep ppl busy, swerving from one meme or madcap news, condemnations of indviduals, to others, in an endless cycle of trivia, scary nonsense, designed to obfuscate what is really going on.
And despite all the headlines touting “100% effective” (based solely on a slanted press release from Moderna), the absolute risk reduction is probably only 0.3% or less.
Yes Doc Robinson, one can safely say, less than 1 %! My post was about numbers that would make a 6th – 7th grader (here) either shake their heads, laugh, or call “total BS,” but apparently nobody in power, the media, etc. even twitches an eyebrow. Yeah, and docs and nurses have been a big disapointment for me (present company and some very brave ones excepted) – I expected a little more spine. Nothing like facing losing your job I guess.
The French Authorities have just admitted they screwed up part of the Covid data. Of course they don’t put it in those terms, but say they are now ‘communicating’ more *precise* data than before.
It concerns cases. Previous (I was always suspicious of these numbers, as they weren’t well defined.. and much too high, which caused me to *overestimate* the number of false positives via PCR, so I’m sort of happy because I really could not make things add up, so to speak..):
Officialdom reported ‘cases’ based on, i.e. corresponding to, number of positive tests!
…Some ppl even had, and have, as many as 15 pos. tests! (Easy to imagine, v. sick patient in hospital..)
The excuse is that with the previous policy they protected privacy and hid the identity of the patients, which generated a separate ‘code’ or ‘identity tag’ for each test. Morevoer the tests were of various kinds, taken in different places, by different methods, etc.
Now they are changing that and have a ‘new algo.’ Called in F de-doubling” ha ha, implying, cases were doubled, now we ‘de-double.’
We are told this ‘only’ concerns electronically transmitted data (i.e. via the internet, and not signed certificates by post.) It is now clear (to me and others) that the very important distinction between these methods of transmission has allowed all kinds of fudging of the data for the larger public.
Quote right from the site, check it out,
Les indicateurs recalculés avec cette nouvelle méthode montrent:
Une différence à la baisse de 12% pour le taux d’incidence France entière
Une différence à la baisse de 8% pour le taux de positivité France entière
Une différence à la baisse de 6% pour le nombre total de cas confirmés.
Trans: re-calcs with the new method show, for the whole of France, 12% less for incidence, 8% less positivity rate (which is a comparison to total tests, so pretty meaningless anyway), and total confirmed cases: minus 6%.
However, there are still some mix-ups or mysteries, imho.
The electronic, aka internet, data is analysed and apparently, as stated, applied to F in general. But that concerns about (hard to find out, not sure?) only 20 to 25%, maybe a bit more, of data. So is this an exrapolation? They don’t say.
20 May 2021.
The CDC changes its criteria (e.g. vaxxed ppl will no longer be counted as Cov-infected if mild symptoms for ex.), France backwardates its stats…
All this is ordered by certain ppl / corps / groups from above. One can’t doubt that any longer. The obfuscations, shoddy defs., fraudulent data collection / categorisation, blatant manipulations of numbers, etc. are beyond the pale.
Exs. to quote. Mini numbers, re. vax. – 18 vs. 0.
Worse, 4 vs. 0:
Vax, wow super! 100% efficacity! Because only 4 – four! Out of 3,700 adolescents ‘got covid’ – > .all the 4 were in the placebo group.
Academic math-n-stats basics (taught in EU from grade 5 – 6 on, measurement and categorisation, etc.), ordinary logic, ‘basic’ common sense, have been surpressed, cancelled (to adopt the modern terms) via massive fear-inducedment, threats, wielding of Authority by Gvmts. I’ll stop there for now.
Yeadon <-> V. D. Bossche
Oh Man, that is all that was needed to confuse things further and cheeze ppl off – Contra-da-mainstream-BS figures like Bossche and Yeadon, quarelling in public!
They are not experienced in messaging, in politicking, in influencing, and are filled with ego-hubris, even to the point of adopting a kind of missionary role.
Not that I blame them for it in any way, as an outsider that role is practically imposed, is almost impossible to escape. Both are essential figures worthy of attention, and are brave. (The PTB I suspect counts on these kinds of snarls.)
They should just do a Zoomie, or meet in Amsterdam, (ha ha) and agree to an agenda of (say) 10 points, both stating, we disagree on ‘some stuff’, science evolves, moves (heh assumed is forward but backwards happens too) others can be discussed.
Meanwhile, the 10 points listing the essentials, on their position re. the vaxxes could be:
Until more data comes in and more thorough, clever analysis / different theoretical approaches are compared (1) .. Vaxxes are useless, they don’t shield, protect, and may even be dangerous, in that .. (low level expl.)
———
1. The data is shoddy, unreliable, corrupted and not useful in any case, another problem…
Varied links. Bloggish:
Vaccine safety updates from Lockdown Sceptics.
Instituted Science:
Excess deaths associated with covid-19 pandemic in 2020: age and sex disaggregated time series analysis in 29 high income countries.
(excess deaths are practically the only stat. worth paying attention to.)
https://www.bmj.com/content/373/bmj.n1137
MSM, Daily Mail:
388 people aged under 60 with ‘NO underlying health conditions’ have died of Covid in England’s hospitals.
A link to share re. Yeadon, interview, about one hour, on Delingpod.
Lays out the basics of his thoughts, his conclusions.
